silverback Posted September 5, 2019 Author Share Posted September 5, 2019 nice one everyone, thanks for the photos and links Jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 Derek Uzzell - 2019-08-30 8:24 AM Your Ducato is a 2019 model, so the chances of earth-strap corrosion affecting it in the short term seem pretty small to me, but - if you want to ‘future proof’ yourself - fit an extra earth strap now. And then they'll both fail and need changing in a few years at the same time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 Well dry today so decided to check my earth strap on X250 not difficult to remove it with the air filter in place using a 3/8 drive ratchet and 13mm socket found it to be in good order so replaced it it was 200mm long with 8mm hole one end & 10mm hole on the other end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverback Posted September 13, 2019 Author Share Posted September 13, 2019 nice one , job done, at least the thread reminded you of things to do jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 witzend - 2019-09-13 5:07 PM Well dry today so decided to check my earth strap on X250 not difficult to remove it with the air filter in place using a 3/8 drive ratchet and 13mm socket found it to be in good order so replaced it it was 200mm long with 8mm hole one end & 10mm hole on the other end That looks like the original earth strap which has been known to fail. It will probably be OK, but knowing how sensitive the electronic controls are, I would replace it with a tinned copper strap just to be sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TnT Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 The problem of corrosion of the earth strap on the Fiat X250 has been well documented: in summary, the corrosion taking place is galvanic corrosion between dissimilar metals INSIDE the crimped-on steel terminal and so may not be visible unless one cuts through the terminal where it is crimped onto the wire - after which you'll have to replace the lead anyway. I think it was Dave Newell who first documented this and advised replacing a Fiat earth strap every five years as a precautionary measure. (I can't find the link now I want to quote him!) The issue was also covered by the late Allen Evans in http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/earth-strap-problems.php. If the strap on the X290 is in a similar location one must expect similar problems. Fitting an all-copper strap like the Auprotec in the original location may perhaps provide a lifetime solution to the problem. Fitting any type of strap of suitable cross-section anywhere where it is out of road spray is probably also a life-time solution. I guess its quite possible that if a supplementary earth strap is fitted, the original Fiat strap can be left to rot through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted September 15, 2019 Share Posted September 15, 2019 I think you will find the first person to raise the issue was Nick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 The Fiat ‘earth strap’ issue was initially highlighted here by Nick Fisher (euroserv) in this 2010 forum thread https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/X250-Engine-earth-fault/21815/ When the thread was suddenly resurrected 6 years later, in his posting of 24 December 2016 4:55 PM there, Allan Evens (aandncaravan) suggested that the earth strap be regularly replaced. We would suggest that the Earth strap on a Motorhome is replaced as a matter of course after around 4 - 5 years because of the impact it can have on charging the habitation batteries when running off the Alternator. A poor Earth strap has the potential to more than half the charge rate to the Habitation battery. Allan went on to say that experimentation had shown that galvanic corrosion could occur between the standard strap’s crimped-on eyelets and the braided copper strap itself. Consequently removing and visually checking the condition of a standard Fiat earth strap won’t prove that it is in satisfactory condition. (I don’t recall Dave Newell commenting on Fiat earth straps - and I never forget anything ;-) ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 TnT - 2019-09-15 8:50 PM where it is out of road spray Yeah thats the problem with the second strap I posted a photo of - and why the terminals are caked in grease to protect them. But if you put it under the bonnet its liable to chafe on something else, and could damage what you bolt it to. Its difficult to find any other suitable place than the original one. Now witzend has posted the dimensions you can get a tinned copper replacement from the link I posted for £4.99. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 I wouldn't advise using welding cable as suggested on the other thread. The insulation makes it less flexible, As does the parallel strands instead of braided like a proper earth strap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 John52 - 2019-09-03 7:38 PM These are what I use: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Car-Engine-Gearbox-Battery-Earth-Lead-Strap-9-to-24-Inch-Choose-Terminal-sizes/322794821937?hash=item4b28121931:m:mxeX3kZ04RCh9mFozvU9dFA Have you mistakely posted the wrong link as You said earlier 50 sqd 11mm that link is for 30sqd 8mm The sizes I posted are for x250 https://tinyurl.com/yyy78aqg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted September 17, 2019 Share Posted September 17, 2019 witzend - 2019-09-17 5:07 PM John52 - 2019-09-03 7:38 PM These are what I use: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Car-Engine-Gearbox-Battery-Earth-Lead-Strap-9-to-24-Inch-Choose-Terminal-sizes/322794821937?hash=item4b28121931:m:mxeX3kZ04RCh9mFozvU9dFA Have you mistakely posted the wrong link as You said earlier 50 sqd 11mm that link is for 30sqd 8mm The sizes I posted are for x250 https://tinyurl.com/yyy78aqg No the link says 25 mm2 and if you zoom into the photo you can see 25 marked on the terminals Thicker cable is always better but you have to draw a line somewhere and 25mm2 is adequate. (Some of those in accessory shops are only 10mm2 - and are battery leads which are not as flexiible as earth straps as they are not designed for as much movement.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry McG Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 Can anyone advise what length and what terminal end sizes are required for an X290? 200mm with 8mm and 10mm terminals? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Car-Engine-Gearbox-Battery-Earth-Lead-Strap-9-to-24-Inch-Choose-Terminal-sizes/322794821937?hash=item4b28121931:m:mxeX3kZ04RCh9mFozvU9dFA or the auprotect ones from here https://www.amazon.co.uk/AUPROTEC-Battery-Earth-Ground-Terminal/dp/B014SX39TS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 I went along to my local motor accessory shop and tried various ones to get the right length, thickness and fittings. Watching the Panorama programme about Amazon last night, I'm increasingly likely to support local trade rather than give all my details and movements to the richest man in the world. (And get it right first time) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 Gerry Suggest you ask about this on the Fiat Forum and specify the build-year of the (presumably Ducato) X290 vehicle you have and the capacity (2.0l, 2.3l, 3.0l) of its motor. I THINK all X250 and X290 Ducatos with 2.3litre motors have the same specificatiion earth strap, so the data (200mm with 8mm and 10mm terminals) has a good chance of being right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will86 Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 Billggski - 2020-02-18 9:07 AM Watching the Panorama programme about Amazon last night, Avoided them for years. Awful setup especially their Prime delivery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will86 Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 Braided Cable Strap. However its treated and however flexible it is, over time copper hardens and minute cracks can occur interfering with the energy flow. Accept the cost and replace it often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry McG Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 Derek Uzzell - 2020-02-18 9:14 AM Gerry Suggest you ask about this on the Fiat Forum and specify the build-year of the (presumably Ducato) X290 vehicle you have and the capacity (2.0l, 2.3l, 3.0l) of its motor. I THINK all X250 and X290 Ducatos with 2.3litre motors have the same specificatiion earth strap, so the data (200mm with 8mm and 10mm terminals) has a good chance of being right. thanks Derek, its a late 2016 Euro 6 x290, 150hp with a 2.3l lump (iirc all the Euro6 engine x290s are 2.3l, but appreciate there are Euro5 x290s with a variety of engines ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 I expect the original earth strap on your 2016 X290 is the same as on my 2015 X290. The Fiat Part Number for X250/X290 models with the 2.3litre motor seems to be 1384487080. One end of the OE strap is designed to ‘lock’ in place, but it shouldn’t really matter if you use a different design of ‘eye’. If you opt for the ebay advert, I suggest you go for a 228mm length, an 8mm hole in one end and a 10mm hole in the other end. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Car-Engine-Gearbox-Battery-Earth-Lead-Strap-9-to-24-Inch-Choose-Terminal-sizes/322794821937?hash=item4b28121931:m:mxeX3kZ04RCh9mFozvU9dFA (£4.95 won’t break the bank...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry McG Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 I was able to spy the engine bay Earth strap on the lower RHS of the engine bay of my 2018 Euro6 2.3L x290 beneath the air box and can confirm it wears a sticker with the Fiat Part Number of 1384487080. FWIW, when I checked the under cab starter battery cox, I also notice there is an earth strap fitted directly to the battery, directly connecting the the starter battery ground terminal to the chassis under the cab floor... is this normal / usual (the photos ive seen of the batteries have not had this fitted) ,or has it been added as a precaution given the well known ground strap issues? this extra strap has a sticker with the p/n 1376738080 on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spospe Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 My 2014 X250 has such a strap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry McG Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 spospe - 2020-02-23 6:52 PM My 2014 X250 has such a strap. Ah well... Nothing to see here then. :$.. Move along please ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 That particular part (and number - which does indeed map to that cable) shows up as being relevant from the start of the X/250 in 2006/7, right through to the current X/290 . The database is silent, however, on which particular subset of models it was actually fitted to..... ....does yours have the factory-fit "battery disconnect switch", though? (just a thought, given some of the info) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry McG Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 Robinhood - 2020-02-23 7:52 PM ....does yours have the factory-fit "battery disconnect switch", though? (just a thought, given some of the info) Not that I'm aware of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted February 23, 2020 Share Posted February 23, 2020 ...normal, then. The parts database shows a shorter version as well, and there is some reference to the battery disconnect feature, which interrupts the earth side of the battery (looking at it, via an additional box on the negative pole), and I wondered whether this was in play here. Patently, the negative pole of the battery needs to go to earth, so what you've got is probably the normal method (and i wasn't going to go out and have a look at mine to check ;-) ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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