Very heavy over cab bed

[weldted]

Hi all, our 2019 A class Burstner 736 I am struggling to raise and secure the over cab bed. Even with no bedding it is really heavy to lift up I have to get it up as far as I can fron a central lift then really push up one side at a time till it clicks home. Twice now the nearside has un latched whilst driving. It is as if there is not much assistance from the gas struts. Although this van was sold to us as new in September 2019 according to Burstner it was made summer of 2018 and delivered to the dealer Oct 2018. This is the first A class we have had and wondered how others have found the over cab bed operation?

[Derek Uzzell]

I don’t know if this 2017 MHFun discussion will be helpful

 

https://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/threads/over-cab-drop-down-bed-advice-needed.147134/

 

but, over the years, there have been plenty of on-line complaints about ‘heavy’ operation of the pull-down cab bed that’s normally fitted to A-class motorhomes.

 

I’ve seen A-class models where, when the bed is raised, a short strap (or straps) is then engaged that tethers the bed to to the roof and prevents the bed from dropping down spontaneously when the motorhome is being driven. It soumds like your bed does not have any sort of ’safety strap’ - fitting one would not help with the heavy operation, but it would remove the risk of the bed falling on your head.

[Brock]

Burstner UK has an Owners Club which might have the answer. I think you will need to become a member.

 

I'm on my third A-class with drop down bed. The first two were manual. It needed a bit of effort to get the beds rising but once on the up, the effort needed reduced until a final push to the ceiling. I don't have strong arms so I used to stand arms spread, extended and locked. I would bend my legs and then move to an upright position with my straitening legs applying the upward pressure to push the bed up evenly on both sides. My head would push up in the centre.

 

If you are keeping the bedding on the bed when lifting it will be heavier but, as I have found, thick pillows can stop you reaching the optimal height and thus the bed does not click into place. My current van has two motors; if i leave the pillows on, often the motors cut out before the bed is fully up to eliminate the risk of children being trapped in bed.

 

Try leaving the bedding off to see if it is easier.

 

Back in May 2017, the advice was given on this forum to "spray all the pivot points with silicone and pull the bed up and down a number of times; might be a good idea to lube the ends of the power assisted struts as well". The problem was a squeaking bed. I followed the advice, also swept the dust away, and the squeak was cured but more importantly, the bed went up with more ease. I've kept the advice, which I think came from Derek, but can't find the actual post.

 

All three of my A-class beds had the strap to fix to the ceiling when in the up position.

 

 

 

[spirou]

Could also be failed gas struts you mention.

[weldted]

I wondered if it may be the struts as this van has been stood over a year until it was sold. As I posted with all the bedding removed it is still very hard to secure it in the up position not what I expect from an £85,000 van. Got quite a few niggles

So far not impressed

[Derek Uzzell]

Brock

 

This May 2017 thread was the one you mention, with “Robbo” suggesting lubrication of the pivot points.

 

https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Rapido-776-ff-drop-down-bed/47112/

[BruceM]

The manual states

 

“You must be able to close the pull down bed without any great effort so there is no tension in the locking mechanism. Objects in the pull down bed can distort the lifting mechanism on one side, resulting in damage”

 

“When closing the pull down bed pull the side fabric panels inwards. This prevents the fabric from getting trapped in the lock of the pull down bed”

 

So I suggest that as an experiment you follow Brock’s suggestion and remove all bedding etc and following the instruction manual see how well the bed locks into position. If it locks just fine then the issue is with the bulkiness/positioning of the bedding.

 

For what it’s worth, when we close our over-cab bed we always reposition the (low profile) pillows and are careful where we place the ladder which in our van is stored with the bed.

 

Also, when lifting the bed, given that the bed swings up in a slight arc, rather than a straight lift we first grab the two handles and swing the body backward, this uses body weight to move the bed from it’s stable down position and from there it’s simply a matter of a push upwards with the aid of the struts.

[Hans]

My former Burstner had no gas struts. And i think they never used it. But the mechanic Bascule system was very strong. and yes you need strong arms. Maybe a motor refit. Or total removal at all if are whit two. And sleep at the back. More space height and no struggle whit chairs.

[Derek Uzzell]

welted’s original posting says “...It is as if there is not much assistance from the gas struts” so presumably the cab bed of his Burstner Ixeo 1736 has them.

[ColinM50]

There's a useful strut calculator on this website, just input your basic info, weight of bed etc, choose the type of end you want and Robert is your Mother's brother

 

Link to Gas Springs Shop

 

Of course Google throws up loads of alternatives

 

(Link shortened - Keithl)

[weldted]

As I stated in my original post no bedding or pillows are left on the bed but it is still a struggle to put it away and twice the nearside has dropped down. I will lubricate all points with silicone spray to day to see if that helps or just add it to the growing list of faults with this van.

[fesspark]

Our 2018 Ixeo 680 G had trouble with the elec. bed jamming and the frame twisted, Burstner through the dealer replaced the mechanism and bed base. fesspark

 

(Edited to remove all capitals)

[skaman]

Another reply for replacing the gas struts.

I would suggest that you get a competent garage to do the job for you as they operate at around 2000 psi and if you're not very careful you could get one going through the windscreen.

They shouldn't have failed on such a new van so go back to the dealer.

[weldted]

Been out this morning and checked, the bed derinately has gas struts fitted, yes it's a new van still under warranty, problem is we are in France and not due home for months, just add it to an oven that only works flat out a sat nav and reversing camera that has a mind of its own, low oil level light that's comes on when it feels like it but Fiat can't find a fault same as the low oil pressure warning light failure. Add that to the gearbox warning gear can't be selected light coming on. No gears turn engine off wait turn on alls fine. We bought a new van so when we take it to the USA for six months we would have a reliable unit. Don't get me wrong you are always going to get a few niggles but this many.

[John52]

I've no experience with Burstner beds but have found gas struts invariably leak and thus become weaker in use.

Is there anywhere you could fit ratchet straps?

I've got one on each corner of my bed and they are dead handy for getting it level :-D

[weldted]

Appreciate the comments but having paid £83,000 for this van sold as new 17/09/2019 I expect better??

[Keithl]

Ted,

 

I am very sorry to hear you are still not satisfied with your 'new' purchase and from having followed your earlier thread when you discovered it was actually over a year old, if I were in your shoes I would be seeking legal advice as to whether the dealer had acted above the law in describing it as 'new' and secondly for all the troubles you are now having, they may well be connected as it must have stood for a long time!

 

Have you considered getting legal advice from maybe the Citizens Advice or any legal cover with MH, car or house insurance?

 

Keith.

[Billggski]

My sympathies are with you, it really does take the shine off driving away in a new motorhome, but sadly, not uncommon.

For cars and most vehicles," new" model years generally start in August of the previous year, allowing for stockpiling and delivery times.

However several chassis for A class and other motorhomes are usually bought beforehand to be fitted out as the factory fits them in.

Taking out a plastic fitting will give you the date it was made, as will the date on the tyres. (2018 being the 20th week of 2018).

But a vehicle is usually classed as " new" on the date it was first registered, unless there was a significant update in engines, chassis or model in the intervening period.

[Derek Uzzell]

The build-date of the Fiat Ducato part of weldted’s motorhome and the date when the Burstner conversion was completed were both discussed at some length in this October 2019 forum thread

 

https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Understanding-a-German-certificate-of-Conformity/53249/

 

There’s no doubt that, when weldted took delivery of the ‘new’ motorhome, the vehicle was significantly older than he might have anticipated. As was said in the earlier thread, this sort of thing is known to happen, but I’ve no idea when a motorhome might no longer be termed “new” while it remains un-registered and unsold to a UK retail purchaser.

 

My (albeit limited) experience of gas-struts is that, if they fail in the short term, they fail ‘hard’ and will then provide no useful assistance. If a strut loses some of its gas over time but is istill providing assistance, re-gassing may be practicable. But, although weldted’s motorhome was completed by Burstner over a year before he bought it and the cab-bed might have remained retracted during that period, it should not be expected that this should result in the struts deteriorating.

 

It may be that raising the bed on similar age/similar A-class Burstner models to weldted’s need a fair amount of effort to raise the cab-bed, or his motorhome’s bed mechanism would benefit from lubrication. However, weldted has said about the bed “...with all the bedding removed it is still very hard to secure it in the up position...” and this does suggest that the struts are problematical. if that’s the case, as the motorhome’s Burstner warranty will still be valid the struts should be replaced free of charge.

 

Weldted has explained that “...we are in France and not due home for months...” and that there are other Fiat and Burstner problems with the vehicle that (I suggest) are considerably more concerning than the hard-to-raise bed. So the logical approach seems to be to have the faults investigated by Fiat and Burstner agencies while abroad or cut the trip short and return to the UK.

[John52]

As I understand it, for gas struts not to weaken over time the seals on the sliding struts have to be 100% air tight - against very high pressure gas!!

Thats a big ask :-S

[Derek Uzzell]

On my 2015 Rapido motorhome all of the interior storage-locker doors that hinge upwards are (according to their size) held in their open position by one, or two, small gas struts. In 2017 one of these struts suddenly failed, but that was no disaster as they are available on-line for about £1.50 each and, when I replaced the failed strut, I added a 2nd strut to the locker doors that I thought Rapido had penny-pinched by factory-fitting a single strut. So, over a 4 year period, just one of over a dozen cheap gas struts has shown any sign of failing to provide its original amount of ‘push'.

 

My Rapido has an island bed that can be raised, with the hinge-line at the headboard end. This is a good size double bed with a thickish Bultex foam mattress that sits on wooden slats and an aluminium framework, and raising the mattress/slats/framework combination and holding it raised involves two gas struts. After over four years, those struts assist raising and holding-up exactly as they did when I bought the Rapido motorhome.

 

I’m not going to contend that gas struts do not weaken over time, as that seems inevitable if the time period is long enough. But even though weldted’s motorhome is older than he thought when he bought it, even if three years had passed since Burstner installed the bed, one would have thought that should normally be too short a time to expect the struts to weaken.