John52 Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:31 PM .. Many of those miners by the way now own their own council houses thanks to those nasty Tories ... Thats what I was trying to get across. His appeal was probably more to people like himself feathering their own nests as it was political ideology. Tory voters voted for him too. The Labour party has practically disowned him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdbrain Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 John52 - 2020-06-16 6:48 PM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:31 PM .. Many of those miners by the way now own their own council houses thanks to those nasty Tories ... Thats what I was trying to get across. His appeal was probably more to people like himself feathering their own nests as it was political ideology. Tory voters voted for him too. The Labour party has practically disowned him. "Tory voters voted for him too" ... Would love to see some proof of that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teflon2 Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 Bulletguy - 2020-06-14 8:16 PM teflon2 - 2020-06-14 7:00 PM Brian Kirby - 2020-06-14 12:53 PM Ouch!! And from the DM! But it quotes days after he entered No 10 and the virus was not admitted by the Chinese until February 2020, I don't think he ha a crystal ball so how the hell was he to know a pandemic was on the horizon ?. This timeline from the British Foreign Policy Group says December 31st 2019 at which point WHO declared it a public health emergency of international concern (PHEIC). https://bfpg.co.uk/2020/04/covid-19-timeline/ https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/inflationandpriceindices/articles/coronavirusandtheeffectsonukprices/2020-05-06#background You need to read tour own link the WHO did't declare it a public health emergency until 31st January. The Chinese government only called it pneumonia when they reported it to the WHO on 31st December. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted June 16, 2020 Author Share Posted June 16, 2020 Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:27 PM Barryd999 - 2020-06-16 6:13 PM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 4:38 PM Barryd999 - 2020-06-16 4:08 PM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 12:22 PM Barryd999 - 2020-06-16 10:44 AM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 9:07 AM Barryd999 - 2020-06-16 8:57 AM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:29 AM Barryd999 - 2020-06-15 10:33 PM Birdbrain - 2020-06-15 6:58 PM Barryd999 - 2020-06-15 6:17 PM Brian Kirby - 2020-06-15 5:54 PM Nicepix - 2020-06-14 8:24 PM Bulletguy - 2020-06-14 5:17 PM Ah but the DM becomes a "lefty loser" paper run by "Remoaner" Geordie Grieg when it publishes articles that don't dance to the Brexiteers narrative. ;-) Interestingly UK has been knocked down into third place on the world stats for Covid-19 deaths as Brazil hit over 41,000 to become the second worst with US well out in the lead. More than a coincidence all three countries led by populism. What is the difference between populism and democracy? *-) I think the above question is based on a false premise. Populism is a form of democracy. I think the question is really, "what is the difference between representative democracy and populism". Representative democracy is what we presently have, where candidates to be MPs are elected by us on the basis that they will have access to information that most of us will not see, and will decide together whether government (the "executive") proposals should be implemented. So we pay them to do that work for us, and trust them to do so to the best of their judgement and ability. Populism, on the other hand, seems more akin to government by permanent referendum, where the MPs become delegates of their constituents, bound to do as instructed by them. The executive merely makes proposals, the proposals are taken by the MPs back to their constituents, who vote on them, and then return the results to parliament where the MPs will vote collectively as individually instructed, with the result becoming an instruction to the executive to proceed accordingly. So, the decision is moved closer to the people. The problems I see with populism are that it caters to the lowest common denominator, and not to the highest common factor. It also makes holding a settled policy almost impossible as moods and events swirl and shift within society. And finally it also seems to me overly prone to being hijacked by charismatic manipulators with dubious agendas. That will be President Cummings then that nobody voted for but is somehow running the country and above the law. Im confused again ... It really grinds you that Mr Cummings broke lockdown rules , you have mentioned it and complained about it quite a lot , yet you found if "funny" when others broke lockdown rules to vandalise and throw history in the sea ... let me in to your logic We weren't under lock down when they decided to chuck the statue in the drink. We were in the middle of the first wave and lock down when Cummings who is the most powerful man in the country decided to break his own rules and go for a jolly as well as breaking many other rules and then trying to cover it all up. I said from the off the protests should not have been allowed to go ahead and were a bad idea but I was pleased to see that statue go and yes it was funny. I liked the Clanging noise and splash. Bit Monty Python. Should have maybe left it at that though. That was enough of a statement really. Quick recap ... Mr Cummings is now "the most powerful man in the country" and you found vandalism and thuggery "funny" ... That just about sums up the mess of the last few weeks The mess has been going on a bit longer than that. Please don't say you and others have held those views for more than a few weeks ... Well ye I suppose now ya mention it , prolly just about 4 years Well now you mention it. You are right. It is about four years since it all became a mess. I cant quite put my finger on it but the economy went down the toilet, we somehow elected a bumbling moron as a leader who has completely screwed up just about everything he touches and we have the worst death toll in Europe from Covid 19 under his watch so yeah I guess we have held those views ever since Johnson hatched his plan for the number 1 job four years ago. Look at the state we are in now as a result. If our economy "went down the toilet" how would you describe most of the other EU members economies one might wonder ??? ... Given you proudly declared Mr Johnson as a "shi& excuse for a human being" your toilet silliness goes quite well with your pure hatred ... Hate on Barry Ours started going down the toilet four years ago though because of the Brexit vote which has now cost us more money than we ever paid into the EU throughout nearly half a century of membership. Its cost us much more in human lives now though as you elected a leader who is totally incompetent and a one trick pony. The one Trick being able to do what a good populist leader does and convince just over half a nation that his path is the right one by telling a pack of lies and promising the earth while dividing the entire nation at the same time. All so he could carve his route to number 10. I thought you said Dominic Cummings was in charge ??? ... If so whats the guff about "elected a leader" , I dont remember him going for the Tory leadership ??? ... If Brexit in your view is to blame for our economy just what was/is to blame for EU worlds economies failing , when did they have a Brexit vote ??? ... As for the Covid death figure here in Blighty its been well documented that black deaths have been a major contributor to our tally , that comes as no surprise after the last couple of weeks when they have judged rioting more important than theirs and others safety including The Police , health workers etc etc ... You found certain parts or maybe all "funny" though ... Strange boy Cummings was part of the package though wasnt he. He's like that little guy in Mad Max beyond Thunder Dome. Master Blaster was it? Controlling the oaf beneath him. They kept him hidden during the election though. In fact he supposedly resigned but of course never really. Selective memory over the economy. We took a big hit because of Brexit long before any downturn in Europe. You know best as always but your Bible told a different story before Brexit ... https://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/oct/15/triple-dip-recession-eurozone-fears-germany-cuts-growth-forecasts ... As for your likening of Mr Cummings to a Mad Max character , when all you have left is Hollywood guff you're in trouble ... Hate on Barry ... By the way Arthur Scargill has nothing to do with the original thread subject , you are very keen to tell me to stick to the thread subject so why havent you ... Again ??? ... Hypocrite That was a prediction long before Brexit which never came true and as we all know we went from the top of the leader board for growth to the bottom within no time following the Brexit vote WTF you on about regarding Arthur Scaregill? I never mentioned the toad. I knew his niece you know when I was at school. Hot little thing she was. Said he gave her the creeps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:53 PM John52 - 2020-06-16 6:48 PM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:31 PM .. Many of those miners by the way now own their own council houses thanks to those nasty Tories ... Thats what I was trying to get across. His appeal was probably more to people like himself feathering their own nests as it was political ideology. Tory voters voted for him too. The Labour party has practically disowned him. "Tory voters voted for him too" ... Would love to see some proof of that How can you prove who someone voted for *-) .... and who would admit to voting for Thatcher now *-) Can you prove any of them voted Labour *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:31 PM a big Labour man .. well of course the Tory press would try to associate the Labour party with every extremist and nut-job .... but how far did this 'big Labour man' actually get in the Labour party *-) Labour party leader wouldn't even share the same platform with him Dennis Healey called the miners 'Lions led by Donkeys' so he tried to form his own party - why would a 'big Labour man' do that *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 John52 - 2020-06-17 7:39 AM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:53 PM John52 - 2020-06-16 6:48 PM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:31 PM .. Many of those miners by the way now own their own council houses thanks to those nasty Tories ... Thats what I was trying to get across. His appeal was probably more to people like himself feathering their own nests as it was political ideology. Tory voters voted for him too. The Labour party has practically disowned him. "Tory voters voted for him too" ... Would love to see some proof of that How can you prove who someone voted for *-) .... and who would admit to voting for Thatcher now *-) Can you prove any of them voted Labour *-) I voted for Thatcher B-) .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 The fundamental point is the mines were public owned. The Labour party was all about supporting that - even not minding if one was slightly underpaid as it was all going to the common good. Wheras Scargill made a career out of fighting it to get more money for his members. Exactly what Thatcher was doing in offering them a cheap council house. When you understand that, you can understand why people would vote for Scargill and Thatcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 pelmetman - 2020-06-17 9:15 AM John52 - 2020-06-17 7:39 AM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:53 PM John52 - 2020-06-16 6:48 PM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:31 PM .. Many of those miners by the way now own their own council houses thanks to those nasty Tories ... Thats what I was trying to get across. His appeal was probably more to people like himself feathering their own nests as it was political ideology. Tory voters voted for him too. The Labour party has practically disowned him. "Tory voters voted for him too" ... Would love to see some proof of that How can you prove who someone voted for *-) .... and who would admit to voting for Thatcher now *-) Can you prove any of them voted Labour *-) I voted for Thatcher B-) .......... My point exactly (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdbrain Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 John52 - 2020-06-17 7:39 AM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:53 PM John52 - 2020-06-16 6:48 PM Birdbrain - 2020-06-16 6:31 PM .. Many of those miners by the way now own their own council houses thanks to those nasty Tories ... Thats what I was trying to get across. His appeal was probably more to people like himself feathering their own nests as it was political ideology. Tory voters voted for him too. The Labour party has practically disowned him. "Tory voters voted for him too" ... Would love to see some proof of that How can you prove who someone voted for *-) .... and who would admit to voting for Thatcher now *-) Can you prove any of them voted Labour *-) "Tory voters voted for him too" ... Your words not mine ... You obviously have no proof to back it up as usual and then you'll accuse me of "trolling" just because I have shown you're lying ... Oh Lordy My Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 I only know what they told me - Of course you can't prove who they voted for. You could prove Scargill was a 'big Labour man' if it were true You could say what job in the Labour party he held *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdbrain Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 John52 - 2020-06-17 7:34 PM I only know what they told me - Of course you can't prove who they voted for. You could prove Scargill was a 'big Labour man' if it were true You could say what job in the Labour party he held *-) Chuckle ... "they" Tories went out of their way to tell you , a fella in a builders van they voted for King Arthur ... Chuckle ... You are funny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 Birdbrain - 2020-06-17 7:38 PM John52 - 2020-06-17 7:34 PM I only know what they told me - Of course you can't prove who they voted for. You could prove Scargill was a 'big Labour man' if it were true You could say what job in the Labour party he held *-) Chuckle ... "they" Tories went out of their way to tell you , a fella in a builders van they voted for King Arthur ... Chuckle ... You are funny I didn't say they went out of their way to tell me Thats something else you have made up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 Brian Kirby - 2020-06-16 1:59 PM Barryd999 - 2020-06-16 10:44 AM.............................. so yeah I guess we have held those views ever since Johnson hatched his plan for the number 1 job four years ago. Look at the state we are in now as a result. Speak for yourself! :-D He wasn't exactly a hit as Foreign Secretary, and as European correspondent for the Telegraph, as it's then owner Conrad Black said of him, he "was such an effective correspondent for us in Brussels that he greatly influenced British opinion on this country’s relations with Europe." Too bloody right he did! He wrote fiction, but the owner liked the Eurosceptic drift of his writing so he got away with it. Must have been rewarding to find ones-self lauded by a convicted fraudster! :-) My distrust of Boris goes back way before the referendum. He is, IMO, deeply flawed. A Demagogue who should have stuck to writing lies for tabloids :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 Snigger.........the Losers are still hurting (lol) (lol) (lol) ........... http://daystobrexit.co.uk/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 pelmetman - 2020-07-03 8:08 AM Snigger.........the Losers are still hurting (lol) (lol) (lol) ........... http://daystobrexit.co.uk/ Actually we 'Losers' enjoying the money taxed from you 'Winners' that 'BoJo is bribing us with not to vote for the Nationalists. So Bojo maintains HIS empire at YOUR expense. Have you thought of anything we 'Losers' have lost that you haven't *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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