jocie Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 I had a windscreen replaced on my 2009 Ducato (Devon Aztec conversion) back in May. I now notice that there is no seal between the scuttle and the windscreen. The original sealing material used by Fiat is dried out and still attached to the scuttle, and I have cleaned out the dirt between this and the glass. What should I use to seal the two together ? I would prefer not to involve the Autowindscreen folk if possible. *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=9786738&ecamp=trf-005&CAWELAID=266956896 How about the above as easy to clean up any mess, or use a black silicon rubber sealant such as Link to Halfords Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 jocie - 2010-08-20 11:26 AM I had a windscreen replaced on my 2009 Ducato (Devon Aztec conversion) back in May. I now notice that there is no seal between the scuttle and the windscreen. The original sealing material used by Fiat is dried out and still attached to the scuttle, and I have cleaned out the dirt between this and the glass. What should I use to seal the two together ? I would prefer not to involve the Autowindscreen folk if possible. *-) Not sure what you mean here, their is no seal between scuttle and screen or am I mis-understanding you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 As the vehicle is less than a year old the windscreen replacement must be within a warranty period so I'd take it back to the windscreen replacement company and ask them to explain it then put it right. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mirage Posted August 20, 2010 Share Posted August 20, 2010 Please correct if I am wrong. On leaving Factory sevel vans for some reason are not sealed between screen and scuttle. If you complain re the inevitable water ingress, dealers will seal screen to scuttle with a sealant. If you are unlucky and have to have a screen replaced it is probable that you will have to foot the cost of re`sealing as it is not part of the original spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jocie Posted August 21, 2010 Author Share Posted August 21, 2010 Now you've got me wondering !! All along the entire length of the flexible flange which is attached to the top of the scuttle, and which presses against the bottom of the windscreen, is a hardened or dried out strip of what looks like original (Fiat?) sealant. I assumed that this should have stuck the flange to the windscreen glass, when it had been installed originally. When the screen was replaced they would have pulled this flange off to get the old screen out. I assumed that the new screen would have been sealed in at the bottom, but it hasn't been. I will contact the screen fitters and question them, after I have visited my local Peugeot dealer ( no Fiat dealer near me) to find out what their new vans have ... I had intended to insert a "non setting" sealant all along , but when cleaning the space prior to doing this, I realised that the flange is bending away from the glass in places so a stronger fixative will be needed. But I don't want to use anything which would make any future windscreen replacement (God forbid! ) problematic by damaging the flange when the glass is removed for example. :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted August 21, 2010 Share Posted August 21, 2010 I'm guessing, but is not the part you refer to as the "scuttle", in fact, a two part plastic moulding? If it is, the scuttle proper is of painted steel, and lives beneath this plastic tray. The windscreen will have been bonded all round to the steel structure framing its aperture, and the edges of the screen, and therefore the sealant, concealed behind plastic covers on the "A" pillars, and across the scuttle. What I think you have seen is the remnants of a supplementary sealant that was applied post production (probably by Devon or the dealer) to prevent water leaking between screen and plastic tray, largely because once onto the underlying metal scuttle, it leaked into the engine bay and all over the top of the engine, to cause rusting around the injectors. It would probably be wise to remove all traces of this old sealant, if necessary taking off the windscreen wiper arms to release the plastic tray, then carefully re-fit the tray and re-seal it to the windscreen at the same point with an external quality clear silicone. I suspect you may find the plastic tray is in two sections, and that a sealant was also applied at the joint between the two. Commercial vans are driven for miles every day, so this leakage is of little consequence as the water soon evaporates off - though it can hardly be beneficial - but motorhomes stand around for days, weeks, or even months, so the water accumulates to cause damaging corrosion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jocie Posted August 21, 2010 Author Share Posted August 21, 2010 Thank you Brian, yes you are correct,it is this two part plastic thingy to which I am referring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolyk Posted August 23, 2010 Share Posted August 23, 2010 The simplest solution is to apply some black electrical pvc tape between the plastic strip and the screen. I've done this on my X250 Boxer and it's virtually unnoticeable. Mine had a gap from new along a short section of the plastic trim and it was allowing rainwater to penetrate into the engine bay. I did intend to take it to Peugeot for them to fix it but the temporary tape mod is fine, so I've not bothered to take it back. If you do apply tape let it "relax" back to its normal length for a few seconds before applying it. And clean the glass and plastic trim beforehand with acetone to ensure a good bond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevina Posted August 23, 2010 Share Posted August 23, 2010 rolyk beat me to it. PVC tape is fine. I've also sealed the ends (by the A frame) with black silicone and added some hoses on the small drain holes plus a few other bits. Engine bay and electrics completely dry now. Kev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jocie Posted August 23, 2010 Author Share Posted August 23, 2010 Thanks folks, I'll give pvc tape a try. One advantage of it is it could be stripped off again if ever needed without risk of damage to anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolyk Posted August 24, 2010 Share Posted August 24, 2010 The pvc tape has a life of a year or so but it only takes a few minutes to replace. As Kev, I've put drain tubes to each end of the scuttle which discharge in the wheel wells. However, my engine is still not totally dry as it still lets water through at each side of the bonnet. I'm going to put a rubber P seal on the underside of the bonnet sides to try to eliminate it. Roly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike88 Posted August 24, 2010 Share Posted August 24, 2010 Unless I've totally misunderstood this thread (which is highly likely) mine already has two drain tubes - one large and one small - through to the underside of the vehicle in order to prevent water getting into the engine compartment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolyk Posted August 24, 2010 Share Posted August 24, 2010 Mike - I don't think you've misunderstood it, it's just that earlier X250's didn't have the drain tubes at the extreme ends of the scuttle. Presumably your fairly recent one has them already fitted. Mine had the engine cover which wasn't fitted to the early vehicles but it didn't have the two small end compartments fitted with a tube. There were just holes there, which allowed water to discharge over the fuse box on the nearside of the engine bay. I've this morning fitted some rubber P section to each end of the bonnet. The P section was a leftover from the sliding door mod I did last year, which prevents water from getting into the space at the top of the door. I'm also going to fit a drain tube to the nearside of the main scuttle channel as my vehicle tends to lay that way on the drive and it collects water on the nearside. Like my previous Transit the only drain tube is on the offside. Roly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackers62 Posted February 1, 2021 Share Posted February 1, 2021 rolyk - 2010-08-23 5:07 PM The simplest solution is to apply some black electrical pvc tape between the plastic strip and the screen. I've done this on my X250 Boxer and it's virtually unnoticeable. Mine had a gap from new along a short section of the plastic trim and it was allowing rainwater to penetrate into the engine bay. I did intend to take it to Peugeot for them to fix it but the temporary tape mod is fine, so I've not bothered to take it back. If you do apply tape let it "relax" back to its normal length for a few seconds before applying it. And clean the glass and plastic trim beforehand with acetone to ensure a good bond. Hi Rolyk, i know its been a while since your post (10 years!) but if you are still there, could I ask what brand of tape you used? Was it just standard black insulation (electrical) tape and what width was it? I have tried black gaffer tape but it wrinkles up when applied between the scuttle and windscreen, looks a mess. Therefore I need something more flexible to go around the curved bits. Also something that will stay stuck and wont come away in the hot sun or pouring rain! Thanks in anticipation :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted February 1, 2021 Share Posted February 1, 2021 Blackers62 - 2021-02-01 9:33 AM Hi Rolyk, i know its been a while since your post (10 years!) but if you are still there, could I ask what brand of tape you used? Was it just standard black insulation (electrical) tape and what width was it? I have tried black gaffer tape but it wrinkles up when applied between the scuttle and windscreen, looks a mess. Therefore I need something more flexible to go around the curved bits. Also something that will stay stuck and wont come away in the hot sun or pouring rain! Thanks in anticipation :-) Paul, Unfortunately Roly has not logged on to the forums for several years now "Last logon 2018-06-04 12:03 PM" so I doubt you will get a reply from him. You may do better by starting a new thread and asking what product others have used for this job. Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayc Posted February 1, 2021 Share Posted February 1, 2021 On the X250 models I have had I have sealed the gap between the scuttle and screen with P profiled rubber strip from Seals Direct https://www.sealsdirect.co.uk/shopping.asp?intDepartmentId=3#19 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted February 1, 2021 Share Posted February 1, 2021 rayc - 2021-02-01 10:21 AM On the X250 models I have had I have sealed the gap between the scuttle and screen with P profiled rubber strip from Seals Direct https://www.sealsdirect.co.uk/shopping.asp?intDepartmentId=3#19 That looks good I'd try that But instead of PVC tape which I first used and as mentioned needs regular replacement I used 30mm Vinyl tape using hair dryer when applying to ease it around the slight bend along the scuttle and its been there for 4 yrs now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laimeduck Posted February 1, 2021 Share Posted February 1, 2021 Hi Rolyk, i know its been a while since your post (10 years!) but if you are still there, could I ask what brand of tape you used? Was it just standard black insulation (electrical) tape and what width was it? I have tried black gaffer tape but it wrinkles up when applied between the scuttle and windscreen, looks a mess. Therefore I need something more flexible to go around the curved bits. Also something that will stay stuck and wont come away in the hot sun or pouring rain! Thanks in anticipation :-) I have successfully sealed the sunroof of my daughter's VW Polo using black fablon type plastic. You cannot even see that it has been done. Did it 3 years ago and it hasn't leaked since. The beauty of this is you can trace the shape to paper then transfer to the fablon and cut out the fablon to the shape of the curve. Overlap the pieces and you can seal the entire screen. Easy, cheap, effective, .... and easy to replace. Jeremy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackers62 Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 rayc - 2021-02-01 10:21 AM On the X250 models I have had I have sealed the gap between the scuttle and screen with P profiled rubber strip from Seals Direct https://www.sealsdirect.co.uk/shopping.asp?intDepartmentId=3#19 Hi Rayc, could i ask what size P seal you fitted on your windscreen? They have several sizes, was it the smallest 6mm? Also, the silicon sealant you used, was it Silkaflex? Many thanks Paul. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayc Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 Hi Rayc, could i ask what size P seal you fitted on your windscreen? They have several sizes, was it the smallest 6mm? Also, the silicon sealant you used, was it Silkaflex? Many thanks Paul. :-) I used P41, flange 9mm bead diameter 6mm. The silicon can be any. I used a clear silicon sealant in a smallish tube as you need very little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 Does it actually matter if water enters engine bay at this point. If driving in heavy rain the whole area would get wet anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackers62 Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 jumpstart - 2021-02-02 11:25 AM Does it actually matter if water enters engine bay at this point. If driving in heavy rain the whole area would get wet anyway. Hi Jumpstart, I thought the same but the water ingress is not good for the engine or surrounding equipment. I discovered wells of water in the injector areas and causing corrosion to the cast aluminium camshaft covers. Also, if you read posts on various fault codes that come up, a majority of them are caused by water ingress into the electrics, especially underneath the fuse box and ECU area. I had an issue myself where P0335 or P0355, crankshaft position sensor fault. I have changed the sensor but also cleaned all associated wiring, fuses, connectors etc. Success, all is fine now The latest on my windscreen/scuttle water leaks - I have sealed the joint between windscreen and scuttle panels (x2), using Sikaflex 11FC and decided not to use the recommended P shaped seal. Job's a good un so far and neat job where the scuttle panels are warped slightly and causing wider gaps where water can get in. Time will tell how long this lasts, so will keep the forum informed. Cheers Paul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 rayc - 2021-02-02 9:14 AM I used P41, flange 9mm bead diameter 6mm. The silicon can be any. I used a clear silicon sealant in a smallish tube as you need very little. Having liked the look of this I ordered a length yesterday from the link and it arrived via RM today in Cornwall less than 24 hrs since I ordered it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 You don't want a sealant thats difficult to get off because you need to remove the scuttle panel to get to the wiper mechanism - might even have to remove it to refit a windscreen washer pipe that comes loose etc - they are only push fit plastic. Non setting sealant like Plumber's Mait would do the job, be easy to remove, and can last many years. But the rain will probably get in somewhere else. Fiat seem to have given up on keeping water out entirely, because they added the plastic cover over the top of the engine to stop water getting on the injectors and rusting them in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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