Citroen Relay and Sargent Ec160 Power Unit

[Alanb]

pepe63 - 2018-04-26 11:43 AM

 

Question from a non-techy onlooker....

 

So has this actually all been wired up "correctly" then.....and working as "it should"..?

...or is this additional "VCR"(which the converter "now remembers adding") a bit of work-around?...

 

:-S

 

My opinion is that it has not been connected correctly, and if I may use a small nuance of language, neither has it been wired correctly.

 

To elaborate, the correct connections have not been made, and those connections that have been made have not been wired with sufficient length of cable to allow the EC160 to be removed for inspection or repair.

 

The voltage controlled relay (VCR) is as suggested, a workaround, which avoids locating and connecting to the D+ wire. The D+ terminal is the alternator field terminal, but connecting and wiring from the alternator may be difficult. Also locating the D+ wire which connects to the alternator/battery warning light on the instrument panel requires specialist knowledge and or access to the base vehicle wiring diagrams.

 

A viable alternative, as used on CBE 12V systems, is to use an ignition switch controlled supply, and monitor it with an integrated VCR.

 

Alan

[mikefitz]

On the Citroen/Fiat 250 and 290 the alternator is controlled by the engine ecu, there is no D+ as seen in older systems. The vehicle electronics simulates a D+ control for the instrument display and this is available on the loom behind the fuse box. Most professional converters specify a "conversion interface box option" at vehicle build, that makes this D+ signal available on a socket at the bottom of the rhd drivers B pillar. This option is rare in panel vans.

To generate a simulated signal for Sargent and similar systems, a simple method is to use an ign on voltage to power a VSR, and use the VSR output as a simulated D+. (as suggested by Alanb)

The ign on can be easily found at the 12v sockets on the dash or the fuel pump feed under the floor mat between the seats.

Using the VCR direct from the engine battery will give rise to the type of problems discussed, it will also confuse the battery charging modes of some Sargent systems.

 

Mike

[Alanb]

mikefitz - 2018-04-26 4:58 PM

 

On the Citroen/Fiat 250 and 290 the alternator is controlled by the engine ecu, there is no D+ as seen in older systems. The vehicle electronics simulates a D+ control for the instrument display and this is available on the loom behind the fuse box. Most professional converters specify a "conversion interface box option" at vehicle build, that makes this D+ signal available on a socket at the bottom of the rhd drivers B pillar. This option is rare in panel vans.

To generate a simulated signal for Sargent and similar systems, a simple method is to use an ign on voltage to power a VSR, and use the VSR output as a simulated D+. (as suggested by Alanb)

The ign on can be easily found at the 12v sockets on the dash or the fuel pump feed under the floor mat between the seats.

Using the VCR direct from the engine battery will give rise to the type of problems discussed, it will also confuse the battery charging modes of some Sargent systems.

 

Mike

 

Mike,

 

Welcome to the forum, and thanks for the interesting post.

 

I was aware of ECU control of the alternator posing the problem, but unsure as to whether it applied in this case. I did not wish to complicate the thread unnecessarily.

 

Alan

[trialsrider]

Alanb - 2018-04-26 1:17 PM

 

pepe63 - 2018-04-26 11:43 AM

 

Question from a non-techy onlooker....

 

So has this actually all been wired up "correctly" then.....and working as "it should"..?

...or is this additional "VCR"(which the converter "now remembers adding") a bit of work-around?...

 

:-S

 

My opinion is that it has not been connected correctly, and if I may use a small nuance of language, neither has it been wired correctly.

 

To elaborate, the correct connections have not been made, and those connections that have been made have not been wired with sufficient length of cable to allow the EC160 to be removed for inspection or repair.

 

The voltage controlled relay (VCR) is as suggested, a workaround, which avoids locating and connecting to the D+ wire. The D+ terminal is the alternator field terminal, but connecting and wiring from the alternator may be difficult. Also locating the D+ wire which connects to the alternator/battery warning light on the instrument panel requires specialist knowledge and or access to the base vehicle wiring diagrams.

 

A viable alternative, as used on CBE 12V systems, is to use an ignition switch controlled supply, and monitor it with an integrated VCR.

 

Alan

 

Totally agree with all of that

[aandncaravan]

I am not sure what is meant by

"A viable alternative, as used on CBE 12V systems, is to use an ignition switch controlled supply, and monitor it with an integrated VCR".

 

but one converter we saw just used an ignition feed to simulate D+ which sort of works but be aware that as soon as the ignition key is turned, the Habitation battery and Starter battery are joined together so either circuit can supply the big amps drawn by the Starter Motor.

Obviously the Habitation battery circuits are not usually designed, or capable of supplying the current that might be passed.

Major damage can be the result, especially if the Starter battery is a bit 'below par', which is often the case when a motorhome or camper is left a few weeks between use.

 

 

A not very satisfactory solution would be to change the Starter battery for a low quality 'budget' that has a resting voltage nearer 12.6v than the 12.8v of a OEM starter battery. The budget battery would drop to it's 12.6v more quickly than the OEM thereby below the VSR 'disconnect' voltage of around 12.8v.

 

No I am not serious, but it shows how a lower voltage battery would work better.

Most VSR's we have seen are modelled around older technology, lower voltage batteries. You can imagine the reverse effect that would be created if the Starter battery was replaced in the future by an AGM battery of 13.1v?

 

Or the Starter battery was given a 14.4v Solar charge, like by a little 'Top-up' 'dash panel' plugged into the cigarette lighter socket? Obviously in this scenario on a camp site, the TV and lights would discharge both Starter and Habitation battery, potentially resulting in a none start (or a 'Sparks and lightning' display inside the Sargent) at the end of the stay.

How about a jump start where the donor vehicle has the engine running, etc.

 

Don't forget as well, that some set-ups also connect the Fridge 12v to the batteries when the Sargent D+ is triggered. Not sure about the EC160, but think that does.

 

 

 

In my opinion, a D+ feed, as recommended by the Units manufacturer, is the only solution. VSR's shouldn't be used in a modern Motorhome or Camper.

 

 

[Alanb]

aandncaravan - 2018-04-27 3:03 PM

 

I am not sure what is meant by

"A viable alternative, as used on CBE 12V systems, is to use an ignition switch controlled supply, and monitor it with an integrated VCR".

 

 

Allan

 

To elaborate on the above, CBE systems take an ignition switch controlled positive, and monitor the voltage using I think an, operational amplifier (OPAMP) used as a voltage monitor. The output of the OPAMP is used to power a small DIL (dual inline) relay that is operated when the monitored voltage reaches charging magnitude. The contacts of the DIL relay are then used to operate the split charge and fridge relays, as well as providing a "simulated D+" output for any other devices.

 

(Note: There is a dual OPAMP mounted on CBE 12V distribution boards, and it is deduction that one section is used for the charge voltage detector above,and the other section is used for the stated 10.6V low battery cut out. Why this voltage is set at such a battery damaging low level, defies my understanding.)

 

By the above the "simulated D+" is only high when the ignition is ON and the system voltage is of a charging magnitude. I was not suggesting the use of a VCR in the conventional way. Since the VCR already exists it makes economic sense to use it, but if starting from scratch I would consider a "12V charge monitoring relay" such as those available on Ebay for about £5.25.

 

As regards using the D+ on the Gareth's vehicle, a converted 2014 Citroen Relay, Mikefitz has pointed out that the D+ is not available on this vehicle unless a conversion pack is ordered when the vehicle is specified.

 

I have now nearly 12 years of experience of using the CBE system on my PVC, and it does not give rise to the problems that you describe.

 

My apologies to the non technically minded for all the jargon.

 

Alan

 

 

[mikefitz]

Thank you for the welcome.

When I was advising on an instalation in a Citroen van, Sargent were asked for advice, they replied:

 

"You can use a VSR, however you will need to connect it to an ignition switched supply, not directly to the vehicle battery. If you do connect directly to the battery, then if the EC328 mains charger is switched on and vehicle battery is selected from the EC328 control panel, the charger output will be connected to the VSR so the increased voltage may cause it to operate and so shut down the leisure loads. "

 

Further communication with Sargent sugested using a relay powered by the fuel pump circuit and using this to swith 12v to the Sargent control input, ( no VSR in citcuit):

 

"When the fuel pump is powered up, the relay coil will energize, this will then give a nice cleanly switched 12V from the vehicle battery to put the EC328 into engine run mode."

 

To help with the original problem, when the engine is switched off the engine battery will stay at a voltage above the VSR switch point for some time. If the ign switch is turned on again for a second or two the electrical load will remove the battery surface charge and the VSR will drop out.

 

My personal view is that the ign on with VSR should be used, as with ign on alone, the starter current may cause proplems.

 

Mike

[aandncaravan]

Alanb and Mike, I was just trying to highlight that with the existing set-up there are other issues waiting to become a problem.

 

I did read about the ECU control, but it wouldn't be difficult for an Auto sparky to retro fit the parts, so still think that direct 'D+' style control is the ideal solution..

 

However, thinking more about your ideas, I agree with you both that the easiest solution is to change the direct Starter battery feed to the VSR to use an ignition controlled source. That should result in the VSR 'disconnecting' as soon as the ignition is turned off.

 

The VSR is almost certainly located outside the EC160, (probably near the Starter battery?) so this solution shouldn't require the 'restricted access' EC160 to be moved at all, yet should overcome all normal VSR related issues.

 

 

Trialsrider, Can I suggest you look on the Starter battery for a 'non manufacturer' add-on connection to the + terminals and try and chase this wire to the VSR, which will hopefully be next to the starter battery, but shouldn't be any further than between the starter battery and the EC160.

If you find the VSR, just disconnect it from the Starter battery and wire it to an Ignition controlled feed.

 

 

Note that the VSR might draw quite a few amps (in extreme circumstances) so choose your Ignition controlled source carefully, or maybe create a new one with a 50amp fuse?.

 

 

.

 

 

 

 

[Alanb]

aandncaravan - 2018-04-28 6:22 PM

 

..........Trialsrider, Can I suggest you look on the Starter battery for a 'non manufacturer' add-on connection to the + terminals and try and chase this wire to the VSR, which will hopefully be next to the starter battery, but shouldn't be any further than between the starter battery and the EC160.

If you find the VSR, just disconnect it from the Starter battery and wire it to an Ignition controlled feed.

 

 

Note that the VSR might draw quite a few amps (in extreme circumstances) so choose your Ignition controlled source carefully, or maybe create a new one with a 50amp fuse?.

 

 

Allan.

 

Trialsrider has stated that there are only 2 wires (+ve & -ve) leaving the vehicle battery. I have therfore assumed that the VCR has been hidden in the hard to access area behind the EC160. I further assume/deduce that the VCR has not been used to switch the habitation battery charging current, but only to supply the SPLIT and EMC terminals of the EC160, which I believe are only low current control inputs. In this configuration I would expect the VB terminal of the EC160, to be looped in parallel with the vehicle batt +ve terminal of the VCR.

 

As regards your assertion that the VCR can draw several amps, -Yes likely when it is carrying the charging current for the habitation battery, but I hope not when only supplying the SPLIT and EMC inputs of the EC160, which is what I suspect it has been used for. If the VCR contacts are carrying the charging current, I would recommend that the circuit should be modified so that this does not happen.

Sargents recommended battery fuse rating is 15A.

 

(The simulated D+ circuitry for the CBE DS520 on my PVC is supplied via a dedicated 5A fuse which is adequate.)

 

Alan

 

Alan

 

[aandncaravan]

Alanb, yes you are right I am confusing the VSR function with it being used in this example as a simulated D+ and the usual role of Split charging, which as you rightly say will be handled by the Sargent box, but the solution still stands up, just doesn't need a high current feed.

 

The VSR is still most likely to be found wired to the Positive wire that runs between the Starter battery and the EC160, so should still be able to be located on that cable run and then given it's own Ignition controlled feed.

The access to the EC160 is a problem though.

 

Maybe the complete solution is to get an auto electrician (or ideally the converter who has created the issues) to make up adapter cables, with the appropriate Sargent Socket/Plug configuration, that will fit between the existing wiring and the EC160, in advance of removing the Sargent box.

 

That way the EC160 can be removed, the VSR issue attended to and the problem of zero cable length addressed at the same time.

Sargent should be able to supply all the information needed to make up the extender cables?

 

This approach of having everything ready in advance should reduce problems created by trying to extend the existing cables in an area where restricted access might lead to expensive mistakes.

 

It should also mean reduced loss of use of the Motorhome as the actual rectification time should be short, probably only an hour or two?.

 

 

 

[trialsrider]

Update. The converter has suggested an option maybe to fit a switch on the dash which would be wired to the cable going from drive battery to Sargent unit. Once switched it could isolate the drive battery and the Sargent should switch on. So I guess it would not be switched on whilst driving as the split charge would not work. Once parked you could switch it on and the drive battery should be isolated.

 

So would this work ? It sounds plausible and maybe a solution which would not require a total rewiring of the electrics and the Sargent unit ? Not an ideal outcome but maybe better than what I have.

[Keithl]

trialsrider - 2018-05-10 4:08 PM

 

Update. The converter has suggested an option maybe to fit a switch on the dash which would be wired to the cable going from drive battery to Sargent unit. Once switched it could isolate the drive battery and the Sargent should switch on. So I guess it would not be switched on whilst driving as the split charge would not work. Once parked you could switch it on and the drive battery should be isolated.

 

So would this work ? It sounds plausible and maybe a solution which would not require a total rewiring of the electrics and the Sargent unit ? Not an ideal outcome but maybe better than what I have.

 

I am assuming he plans to use this switch to control a relay in the main Positive feed from the Drive Battery to the Sargent PSU in which case I would prefer the switch to work 'the other way'. ie switch turned On when driving to connect drive battery to Sargent unit and Off when parked. This way the relay would only be powered On when the alternator was providing power.

 

If I have read what you described correctly the relay would be powered when you are parked and would probably result in a flat battery! You want as little quiescent drain when parked as possible!

 

Keith.

 

Edit to add: Why not control the new relay with an ignition fed live then you will have a totally automatic system as you originally wanted?

[Alanb]

Contrary to what Keith has understood, I think that the suggestion is for the switch to be wired directly into the positive connection from the vehicle battery.

 

(EDIT

I am not sure that the proposal will work. As I understand the current system the connection from the vehicle battery is routed to the VSR and the split charge input of the EC160 in parallel. When you stop the engine the split charge relay in the EC160 will be operated. I think that habitation battery will back feed through the split charge relay and appear at the input side of the VCR. This will remain operated until the habitation battery voltage drops to the VCR release point. Have I got this wrong?)

 

Sargent's specified rating for the vehicle battery circuit is 15A. This exceeds the rating of many switches intended for automotive use, which in the present era are usually used in conjunction with a relay for loads of this magnitude.

 

From thermal current ratings 1 sq mm cable could handle this load. The small extra resistance introduced by the extra cable run to from the switch and the switch contacts would have a considerable reducing effect on the habitation battery recharge current. Hence the driving time required to recharge this battery will be increased.

 

Also you will have to remember to set the switch to the charge position before driving. We are all human and can forget such items. While one solution is to use a checklist before driving, I would prefer a fully automatic system.

 

Alan

[trialsrider]

Alanb - 2018-05-10 6:09 PM

 

Contrary to what Keith has understood, I think that the suggestion is for the switch to be wired directly into the positive connection from the vehicle battery.

 

(EDIT

I am not sure that the proposal will work. As I understand the current system the connection from the vehicle battery is routed to the VSR and the split charge input of the EC160 in parallel. When you stop the engine the split charge relay in the EC160 will be operated. I think that habitation battery will back feed through the split charge relay and appear at the input side of the VCR. This will remain operated until the habitation battery voltage drops to the VCR release point. Have I got this wrong?)

 

Sargent's specified rating for the vehicle battery circuit is 15A. This exceeds the rating of many switches intended for automotive use, which in the present era are usually used in conjunction with a relay for loads of this magnitude.

 

From thermal current ratings 1 sq mm cable could handle this load. The small extra resistance introduced by the extra cable run to from the switch and the switch contacts would have a considerable reducing effect on the habitation battery recharge current. Hence the driving time required to recharge this battery will be increased.

 

Also you will have to remember to set the switch to the charge position before driving. We are all human and can forget such items. While one solution is to use a checklist before driving, I would prefer a fully automatic system.

 

Alan

 

Sorry Alan. My level of electronics know how is way below yours and your baffling me. One thing I do agree with is that I would prefer an automatic system too. But that looks a timely and expensive option. Summer is here and I just want to go away in the van.

 

I don't think he has linked anything in parallel. Surely a toggle type switch that is either on or off connected to the positive feed of the drive battery to the Sargent unit would isolate the drive battery from the Motorhome electrics thus automatically switching on the Sargent? Or am I totally wrong ?

[Keithl]

Alanb - 2018-05-10 6:09 PM

 

I am not sure that the proposal will work. As I understand the current system the connection from the vehicle battery is routed to the VSR and the split charge input of the EC160 in parallel. When you stop the engine the split charge relay in the EC160 will be operated. I think that habitation battery will back feed through the split charge relay and appear at the input side of the VCR. This will remain operated until the habitation battery voltage drops to the VCR release point.

 

Alan

 

Alan,

 

I agree with you!

 

It will not work for exactly the reasons you state, namely the habitation battery will 'back feed' through the Sargent PSU and hold the VSR in the On position and therefore the Sargent PSU will still think the engine is running.

 

Gareth,

 

Sorry but I do not think this idea will work. You either need to live with what you have or rip things apart and wire the VSR correctly(?) with an ignition fed live.

 

Keith.

 

Edit to add: I'll try and do a couple of quick sketches tomorrow to demonstrate the problem.

[trialsrider]

Keithl - 2018-05-10 8:32 PM

 

Alanb - 2018-05-10 6:09 PM

 

I am not sure that the proposal will work. As I understand the current system the connection from the vehicle battery is routed to the VSR and the split charge input of the EC160 in parallel. When you stop the engine the split charge relay in the EC160 will be operated. I think that habitation battery will back feed through the split charge relay and appear at the input side of the VCR. This will remain operated until the habitation battery voltage drops to the VCR release point.

 

Alan

 

 

 

Alan,

 

I agree with you!

 

It will not work for exactly the reasons you state, namely the habitation battery will 'back feed' through the Sargent PSU and hold the VSR in the On position and therefore the Sargent PSU will still think the engine is running.

 

Gareth,

 

Sorry but I do not think this idea will work. You either need to live with what you have or rip things apart and wire the VSR correctly(?) with an ignition fed live.

 

Keith.

 

Edit to add: I'll try and do a couple of quick sketches tomorrow to demonstrate the problem.

 

Thanks for the info. Yep it looks like there is no easy fix here.

[Alanb]

Having thought about it a bit more, I am begining to think that the modification proposed by the converter may even make matters worse!

 

Currently Gareth drives with headlights ON, and drops the battery voltage by switching the ignition ON again after stopping the engine. The load of the headlights and other electrics pulls the battery voltage down to the VCR release point fairly soon. With the proposed switch inserted the use of the ignition switch in this manner will no longer be available.

 

Alan

[trialsrider]

Alanb - 2018-05-11 9:01 AM

 

Having thought about it a bit more, I am begining to think that the modification proposed by the converter may even make matters worse!

 

Currently Gareth drives with headlights ON, and drops the battery voltage by switching the ignition ON again after stopping the engine. The load of the headlights and other electrics pulls the battery voltage down to the VCR release point fairly soon. With the proposed switch inserted the use of the ignition switch in this manner will no longer be available.

 

Alan

 

Sounds like a non starter then. But wouldn't a switch simply act as a means of breaking the circuit between van electrics and Motorhome electrics ? Would it not work in the same way as removing the positive and negative feed from the drive battery to the Sargent altogether? That way the only power going to the Sargent soul be from the solar/ leisure battery and mains hook up ?

[Keithl]

There is actually an added complication and possible dangerous condition with the current setup which a manual disconnect switch could overcome.

 

If the engine was run for a length of time and then stopped the VSR would remain active and the starter and habitation batteries would remain coupled through the Sargent PSU. If the engine was then restarted it is very likely that part of the starter load would be pulled from the habitation battery through the Sargent PSU with damaging consequences. If the system is correctly fused then this would blow otherwise things may be more lively!

 

Adding a manual disconnect switch and always ensuring it was set to disconnect (I won't use On/Off for fear of confusion) would hopefully prevent any possibility of this happening.

 

I'm not sure if it adds further complications without overtaxing my already tired brain!!!

 

You could test what would happen if you where to add a disconnect switch by running the engine for a while then stopping it and either pulling the fuse on the positive feed at the starter battery (assuming it has one!) or disconnecting the wire if not.

 

Keith.

[trialsrider]

Keithl - 2018-05-11 9:50 AM

 

There is actually an added complication and possible dangerous condition with the current setup which a manual disconnect switch could overcome.

 

If the engine was run for a length of time and then stopped the VSR would remain active and the starter and habitation batteries would remain coupled through the Sargent PSU. If the engine was then restarted it is very likely that part of the starter load would be pulled from the habitation battery through the Sargent PSU with damaging consequences. If the system is correctly fused then this would blow otherwise things may be more lively!

 

Adding a manual disconnect switch and always ensuring it was set to disconnect (I won't use On/Off for fear of confusion) would hopefully prevent any possibility of this happening.

 

I'm not sure if it adds further complications without overtaxing my already tired brain!!!

 

You could test what would happen if you where to add a disconnect switch by running the engine for a while then stopping it and either pulling the fuse on the positive feed at the starter battery (assuming it has one!) or disconnecting the wire if not.

 

Keith.

 

I will investigate tomorrow. Thanks

[mikefitz]

Brief comment on VSRs. There are two types, the most common, senses the input voltage, in this case the engine battery, and switches on at 13v and a bit and drops out at a bit less than 13v. It does not care about the leisure battery voltage. The second type is less common and is bi directional sensing. This type will direct power either way. I suspect the former type is fitted in this application.

 

The proposed use of a switch in the engine battery feed to the Sargent may/will cause problems. As I understand things the Sargent needs a connection to the vehicle battery and a separate simulated D+.

 

Either accept the current limitations or take things apart and wire up correctly with a ign live control.

 

Mike

[Alanb]

mikefitz - 2018-05-11 1:07 PM

 

Brief comment on VSRs. There are two types, the most common, senses the input voltage, in this case the engine battery, and switches on at 13v and a bit and drops out at a bit less than 13v. It does not care about the leisure battery voltage. The second type is less common and is bi directional sensing. This type will direct power either way. I suspect the former type is fitted in this application.

 

The proposed use of a switch in the engine battery feed to the Sargent may/will cause problems. As I understand things the Sargent needs a connection to the vehicle battery and a separate simulated D+.

 

Either accept the current limitations or take things apart and wire up correctly with a ign live control.

 

Mike

 

Mike,

 

To be technical, I can understand the possibility of a bi directional VSR which has a pair of steering or blocking diodes connected to both batteries and to the control circuitry. However once the main contacts are closed, surely either battery will feed the VSR control circuitry, independant of VSR type?

 

One way of avoiding this back feeding with a conventional VSR would be to include a high current blocking diode in series with the contacts. This would then defeat the low voltage drop advantage of a VSR as well as making it unidirectional. You might just as well revert to a simple high current blocking diode.

 

Perhaps an alternative approach would be a solid state VSR with MOSFETs in the main power circuit?

However such a device, if it exists, would still have a higher voltage drop than a relay using metallic contacts.

 

I think that what exists in Gareth's vehicle is a conventional VSR, with the output controlling the split charge and EMC relays.

 

Alan

[Alanb]

Gareth,

 

In order to convince you converter and the rest of us that his suggestion, it may be worth trying the following test.

 

Run engine for several minutes so that both batteries are upto charging voltage,

 

Switch OFF engine.

 

Safely disconnect the connection from the vehicle battery to habitation electrics by removing the appropriate fuse.

 

If there is no fuse visible, do not continue, as the removed cable could still be live from the habitation battery. There is a risk of damage, fire, and getting burnt if such a live end was allowed to touch the wehicle body.

 

(The Sargent EC160 installation instructions clearly state that the connection to vehicle battery should be fused at 15A.)

 

With the fuse removed, switching on the ignition should have no effect, and you may not be able to switch the EC160 panel ON for some time.

 

Alan

 

 

[trialsrider]

Alanb - 2018-05-11 3:48 PM

 

Gareth,

 

In order to convince you converter and the rest of us that his suggestion, it may be worth trying the following test.

 

Run engine for several minutes so that both batteries are upto charging voltage,

 

Switch OFF engine.

 

Safely disconnect the connection from the vehicle battery to habitation electrics by removing the appropriate fuse.

 

If there is no fuse visible, do not continue, as the removed cable could still be live from the habitation battery. There is a risk of damage, fire, and getting burnt if such a live end was allowed to touch the wehicle body.

 

(The Sargent EC160 installation instructions clearly state that the connection to vehicle battery should be fused at 15A.)

 

With the fuse removed, switching on the ignition should have no effect, and you may not be able to switch the EC160 panel ON for some time.

 

Alan

 

 

Hi Alan

 

I understand the test procedure but what exactly is the hypothesis you are testing ?

[Keithl]

trialsrider - 2018-05-11 5:46 PM

 

Alanb - 2018-05-11 3:48 PM

 

Gareth,

 

In order to convince you converter and the rest of us that his suggestion, it may be worth trying the following test.

 

Run engine for several minutes so that both batteries are upto charging voltage,

 

Switch OFF engine.

 

Safely disconnect the connection from the vehicle battery to habitation electrics by removing the appropriate fuse.

 

If there is no fuse visible, do not continue, as the removed cable could still be live from the habitation battery. There is a risk of damage, fire, and getting burnt if such a live end was allowed to touch the wehicle body.

 

(The Sargent EC160 installation instructions clearly state that the connection to vehicle battery should be fused at 15A.)

 

With the fuse removed, switching on the ignition should have no effect, and you may not be able to switch the EC160 panel ON for some time.

 

Alan

 

 

Hi Alan

 

I understand the test procedure but what exactly is the hypothesis you are testing ?

 

That as long as the voltage of the habitation battery remains above the lower threshold for the VSR (12.8 V?) the Sargent PSU will NOT switch on.