Guest pelmetman Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 1:27 PM Might be more constructive than calling people who disagree with you pompous. Is that worse than Remoaners calling Brexiteers xenophobes & racists? ;-) .......... Cant say I'm bothered by the Remoaner name calling :D ........As I suspects its just entrenched us Brexiteers voting intentions B-) ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 1:27 PM rupert123 - 2018-11-30 8:59 PM.....................…. The local genius on all things EU which the rest of us thick 'o' completed do not understand. ……………... OK Henry, as you clearly think you are better informed than Barry, how about you give those of us who can't see what you can, a precis of what the present EU deal actually entails? Might be more constructive than calling people who disagree with you pompous. Pompous probably the wrong word Brian, arrogant would be better. It is a pointless argument anyway. I have never said I disagree just cannot abide the constant you do not understand attitude of Barry. I am no better informed than anyone else, we are all guessing anyway, no one knows what is going to happen. Yes I mistrust all the predictions, as I did two years ago and it turned out it was right to do so. I suggest we get back to this in twelve months time to see who is correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 John52 - 2018-12-01 1:11 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 8:00 AM Coz all the ones I know just wanna "get the hell out of Dodge" B-) .......(as in Dodgy EU) >:-) ....... Out of the EU and in to what *-) Are they really daft enough to think the Brexit politicians they are handing power to will care about them *-) We'll be handing over power to those WE can vote out >:-) ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-12-01 4:15 PM...……………... We'll be handing over power to those WE can vote out >:-) ........... I know I've asked this before, but I don't think I ever got an answer. Which EU legislation is it you so dislike that you want to leave? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 5:34 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 4:15 PM...……………... We'll be handing over power to those WE can vote out >:-) ........... I know I've asked this before, but I don't think I ever got an answer. Which EU legislation is it you so dislike that you want to leave? All of it ;-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-12-01 6:15 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 5:34 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 4:15 PM...……………... We'll be handing over power to those WE can vote out >:-) ........... I know I've asked this before, but I don't think I ever got an answer. Which EU legislation is it you so dislike that you want to leave? All of it ;-) ........ On what grounds? That it is all bad legislation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 6:23 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 6:15 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 5:34 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 4:15 PM...……………... We'll be handing over power to those WE can vote out >:-) ........... I know I've asked this before, but I don't think I ever got an answer. Which EU legislation is it you so dislike that you want to leave? All of it ;-) ........ On what grounds? That it is all bad legislation? On the grounds that I object being told what to do in my own country by folk I can not kick out at the ballot box *-) .......... Unlike you Remoaners Brian......I like living in a democracy >:-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 rupert123 - 2018-12-01 4:13 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 1:27 PM rupert123 - 2018-11-30 8:59 PM.....................…. The local genius on all things EU which the rest of us thick 'o' completed do not understand. ……………... OK Henry, as you clearly think you are better informed than Barry, how about you give those of us who can't see what you can, a precis of what the present EU deal actually entails? Might be more constructive than calling people who disagree with you pompous. Pompous probably the wrong word Brian, arrogant would be better. It is a pointless argument anyway. I have never said I disagree just cannot abide the constant you do not understand attitude of Barry. I am no better informed than anyone else, we are all guessing anyway, no one knows what is going to happen. Yes I mistrust all the predictions, as I did two years ago and it turned out it was right to do so. I suggest we get back to this in twelve months time to see who is correct. But, in twelve months time we shall have left (or at least that is the present intention) so, if we then find out that we have become poorer as a result, we can't row back. On that basis I don't think the discussion at all pointless. In fact, I think it vitally important. Unfortunately, some people did make disparaging comments about the degree of understanding of those who voted to leave. Can you say, hand on heart, that you have discovered nothing over the past two years about Brexit and its consequences that you didn't already know. I know I have. Have you tried reading those 500 odd pages of the present deal and found them easy to understand? I have, and found them almost impenetrable, and I thought I could usually make sense of this stuff. I could no more vote on that agreement, if given the choice, than fly. I assume many of our MPs will be in the same position. So, lets just agree that many people voted for Brexit because they mistrusted the EU, which is fair enough, but did not vote for what would happen to the UK after we left, because no-one told us in tangible terms what a post Brexit UK would look like. That, I think, is what underlay those "don't understand" comments, not arrogance or pomposity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 6:36 PM rupert123 - 2018-12-01 4:13 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 1:27 PM rupert123 - 2018-11-30 8:59 PM.....................…. The local genius on all things EU which the rest of us thick 'o' completed do not understand. ……………... OK Henry, as you clearly think you are better informed than Barry, how about you give those of us who can't see what you can, a precis of what the present EU deal actually entails? Might be more constructive than calling people who disagree with you pompous. Pompous probably the wrong word Brian, arrogant would be better. It is a pointless argument anyway. I have never said I disagree just cannot abide the constant you do not understand attitude of Barry. I am no better informed than anyone else, we are all guessing anyway, no one knows what is going to happen. Yes I mistrust all the predictions, as I did two years ago and it turned out it was right to do so. I suggest we get back to this in twelve months time to see who is correct. But, in twelve months time we shall have left (or at least that is the present intention) so, if we then find out that we have become poorer as a result, we can't row back. On that basis I don't think the discussion at all pointless. In fact, I think it vitally important. Unfortunately, some people did make disparaging comments about the degree of understanding of those who voted to leave. Can you say, hand on heart, that you have discovered nothing over the past two years about Brexit and its consequences that you didn't already know. I know I have. Have you tried reading those 500 odd pages of the present deal and found them easy to understand? I have, and found them almost impenetrable, and I thought I could usually make sense of this stuff. I could no more vote on that agreement, if given the choice, than fly. I assume many of our MPs will be in the same position. So, lets just agree that many people voted for Brexit because they mistrusted the EU, which is fair enough, but did not vote for what would happen to the UK after we left, because no-one told us in tangible terms what a post Brexit UK would look like. That, I think, is what underlay those "don't understand" comments, not arrogance or pomposity. No one told us what post Brexit UK would look like Brian because no one knows. Why would we row back, we had democratic vote, or did I miss something here. The deal of Mrs May seems the only one that will work so sign it and get on with sorting out the many bits in the future; it is not a complete deal after all just a beginning. We will end up with an open Irish border, which will be interesting, goods will flow via this regardless of tariffs, all the benefits with no payments. Ireland should do really well from this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 rupert123 - 2018-12-01 4:13 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 1:27 PM rupert123 - 2018-11-30 8:59 PM.....................…. The local genius on all things EU which the rest of us thick 'o' completed do not understand. ……………... OK Henry, as you clearly think you are better informed than Barry, how about you give those of us who can't see what you can, a precis of what the present EU deal actually entails? Might be more constructive than calling people who disagree with you pompous. Pompous probably the wrong word Brian, arrogant would be better. It is a pointless argument anyway. I have never said I disagree just cannot abide the constant you do not understand attitude of Barry. I am no better informed than anyone else, we are all guessing anyway, no one knows what is going to happen. Yes I mistrust all the predictions, as I did two years ago and it turned out it was right to do so. I suggest we get back to this in twelve months time to see who is correct. You say you 'mistrust all predictions', one of which being the infamous £350m a week lie which got debunked as pure nonsense even before the referendum, so would certainly have been 'right to mistrust'......yet still went ahead and voted Brexit. :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 rupert123 - 2018-12-01 9:18 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 6:36 PM rupert123 - 2018-12-01 4:13 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 1:27 PM rupert123 - 2018-11-30 8:59 PM.....................…. The local genius on all things EU which the rest of us thick 'o' completed do not understand. ……………... OK Henry, as you clearly think you are better informed than Barry, how about you give those of us who can't see what you can, a precis of what the present EU deal actually entails? Might be more constructive than calling people who disagree with you pompous. Pompous probably the wrong word Brian, arrogant would be better. It is a pointless argument anyway. I have never said I disagree just cannot abide the constant you do not understand attitude of Barry. I am no better informed than anyone else, we are all guessing anyway, no one knows what is going to happen. Yes I mistrust all the predictions, as I did two years ago and it turned out it was right to do so. I suggest we get back to this in twelve months time to see who is correct. But, in twelve months time we shall have left (or at least that is the present intention) so, if we then find out that we have become poorer as a result, we can't row back. On that basis I don't think the discussion at all pointless. In fact, I think it vitally important. Unfortunately, some people did make disparaging comments about the degree of understanding of those who voted to leave. Can you say, hand on heart, that you have discovered nothing over the past two years about Brexit and its consequences that you didn't already know. I know I have. Have you tried reading those 500 odd pages of the present deal and found them easy to understand? I have, and found them almost impenetrable, and I thought I could usually make sense of this stuff. I could no more vote on that agreement, if given the choice, than fly. I assume many of our MPs will be in the same position. So, lets just agree that many people voted for Brexit because they mistrusted the EU, which is fair enough, but did not vote for what would happen to the UK after we left, because no-one told us in tangible terms what a post Brexit UK would look like. That, I think, is what underlay those "don't understand" comments, not arrogance or pomposity. No one told us what post Brexit UK would look like Brian because no one knows. Why would we row back, we had democratic vote, or did I miss something here. Because this isn't an GE where when government don't deliver or we have a bad five years of office we can simply vote 'em out and get another lot in. Leaving the EU isn't a five year term and would prove extremely difficult to go back when Brexiters find life is not so rosy 'n cosy after all. This is a two year old clip but summed the situation up perfectly even back then.....and since then it's got a lot lot worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted December 1, 2018 Author Share Posted December 1, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-12-01 4:15 PM John52 - 2018-12-01 1:11 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 8:00 AM Coz all the ones I know just wanna "get the hell out of Dodge" B-) .......(as in Dodgy EU) >:-) ....... Out of the EU and in to what *-) Are they really daft enough to think the Brexit politicians they are handing power to will care about them *-) We'll be handing over power to those WE can vote out >:-) ........... When did we get the right to vote out our Head of State and House of Lords *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 John52 - 2018-12-01 10:42 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 4:15 PM John52 - 2018-12-01 1:11 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 8:00 AM Coz all the ones I know just wanna "get the hell out of Dodge" B-) .......(as in Dodgy EU) >:-) ....... Out of the EU and in to what *-) Are they really daft enough to think the Brexit politicians they are handing power to will care about them *-) We'll be handing over power to those WE can vote out >:-) ........... When did we get the right to vote out our Head of State and House of Lords *-) Put your hobby horse away and accept you live in a democratic Royalist country >:-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-12-02 8:29 AM democratic Royalist OK Baldrick, How can you have a democratc Royalist *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Good pice by Austin Mitchell Labour man or not ... https://brexitcentral.com/dont-taken-rampant-remainers-campaign-fear/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-12-02 11:07 AM Good pice by Austin Mitchell Labour man or not ... https://brexitcentral.com/dont-taken-rampant-remainers-campaign-fear/ Really *-) he lost me by he time he said Remainers claimed Brexit would lead to Bubonic Plague *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 John52 - 2018-12-02 10:58 AM pelmetman - 2018-12-02 8:29 AM democratic Royalist OK Baldrick, How can you have a democratc Royalist *-) I said......Democratic......Royalist.......Country ;-) ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 rupert123 - 2018-12-01 4:13 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 1:27 PM rupert123 - 2018-11-30 8:59 PM.....................…. The local genius on all things EU which the rest of us thick 'o' completed do not understand. ……………... OK Henry, as you clearly think you are better informed than Barry, how about you give those of us who can't see what you can, a precis of what the present EU deal actually entails? Might be more constructive than calling people who disagree with you pompous. Pompous probably the wrong word Brian, arrogant would be better. It is a pointless argument anyway. I have never said I disagree just cannot abide the constant you do not understand attitude of Barry. I am no better informed than anyone else, we are all guessing anyway, no one knows what is going to happen. Yes I mistrust all the predictions, as I did two years ago and it turned out it was right to do so. I suggest we get back to this in twelve months time to see who is correct. Being well informed is not being Pompous or Arrogant, its just being well informed. You say you are no better informed than anyone else, well clearly your not very well informed if you think we can just dismiss the money we are due to pay the EU, walk away and also not have a border issue in Northern Ireland. I think I stated that I wasn't calling Brexiteers thick, just that many clearly do not understand Brexit properly because they just haven't kept up, probably buried their heads in the sand somewhat also. As for your comments which really are turning into "the worlds biggest yawn" about having further referendums until you get the answer you want we only need one. We voted in a binary referendum with no clue what the outcome would be, we now know what it will look like and its awful. The public deserve a chance to sign it off or not. If they agree to Mays deal then fine, off we go. If not then the people will have made a decision based on all the facts and not simply on what was in the mystery box in 2016. That will be the end of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Barryd999 - 2018-12-02 12:34 PM That will be the end of it. Unless the result is very close ( again ) ! ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 John52 - 2018-12-01 10:42 PM When did we get the right to vote out our Head of State and House of Lords *-) You have had that right for a long time. There is a Republican movement in the U.K. - all you/ they have to do is to democratically win the support of a majority of voters and become the government. Then you/they will be able to scrap the monarchy and House of Lords. If you do decide to take that path I would just ask you to have an alternative in place for afterwards as we don't want another cock-up like Brexit. :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-12-02 11:47 AM John52 - 2018-12-02 10:58 AM pelmetman - 2018-12-02 8:29 AM democratic Royalist OK Baldrick, How can you have a democratc Royalist *-) I said......Democratic......Royalist.......Country ;-) ....... I know what you said. But it doesn't make any sense (as usual) :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted December 2, 2018 Author Share Posted December 2, 2018 malc d - 2018-12-02 2:03 PM all you/ they have to do is to democratically win the support of a majority of voters and become the government. Harold Wilson did that, ,but he couldn't become the Government until she had invited him to. She kept him out of power for days whilst Heath was trying to bribe the Liberals (Like May bribed the DUP) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-12-01 6:35 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 6:23 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 6:15 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 5:34 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 4:15 PM...……………... We'll be handing over power to those WE can vote out >:-) ........... I know I've asked this before, but I don't think I ever got an answer. Which EU legislation is it you so dislike that you want to leave? All of it ;-) ........ On what grounds? That it is all bad legislation? On the grounds that I object being told what to do in my own country by folk I can not kick out at the ballot box *-) .......... Unlike you Remoaners Brian......I like living in a democracy >:-) ......... We've been there before Dave. You can directly kick out the MEPs at the ballot box. You can directly kick out your government at the ballot box (which indirectly removes them from the European Council), and as your elected representatives nominate the Commissioners, you have democratic control over them too. After that, who is left? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-12-02 4:51 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 6:35 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 6:23 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 6:15 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-12-01 5:34 PM pelmetman - 2018-12-01 4:15 PM...……………... We'll be handing over power to those WE can vote out >:-) ........... I know I've asked this before, but I don't think I ever got an answer. Which EU legislation is it you so dislike that you want to leave? All of it ;-) ........ On what grounds? That it is all bad legislation? On the grounds that I object being told what to do in my own country by folk I can not kick out at the ballot box *-) .......... Unlike you Remoaners Brian......I like living in a democracy >:-) ......... We've been there before Dave. You can directly kick out the MEPs at the ballot box. You can directly kick out your government at the ballot box (which indirectly removes them from the European Council), and as your elected representatives nominate the Commissioners, you have democratic control over them too. After that, who is left? Yeah Brian ;-) ....... I can vote to kick someone off the gravy train *-) ....... Progress eh? >:-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 John52 - 2018-12-02 3:04 PM malc d - 2018-12-02 2:03 PM all you/ they have to do is to democratically win the support of a majority of voters and become the government. Harold Wilson did that, ,but he couldn't become the Government until she had invited him to. She kept him out of power for days whilst Heath was trying to bribe the Liberals (Like May bribed the DUP) Well he didn't win more than 50% did he? >:-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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