747 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Brian Kirby - 2019-01-15 7:50 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-15 9:37 AM Seems Brexit Barry is confused ... Despite telling us constantly how folk didn't know what they were voting for it now seems the good people of Sunderland who voted by 60% to leave now they are better informed would according to the latest Sunderland Echo poll vote by 70% to leave with no deal ... Oooops So why did they vote Brexit, Antony? You seem to understand, but I still don't get it. Can you explain, for a bear of very little brain, please? No-one ever seems to want to say. If I knew, I might even begin to understand. Well, understand this Brian: Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it. If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU. Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope. You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-15 7:50 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-15 9:37 AM Seems Brexit Barry is confused ... Despite telling us constantly how folk didn't know what they were voting for it now seems the good people of Sunderland who voted by 60% to leave now they are better informed would according to the latest Sunderland Echo poll vote by 70% to leave with no deal ... Oooops So why did they vote Brexit, Antony? You seem to understand, but I still don't get it. Can you explain, for a bear of very little brain, please? No-one ever seems to want to say. If I knew, I might even begin to understand. Well, understand this Brian: Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it. If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU. Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope. You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position. Speaking as a Southerner.............Well said B-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Bulletguy - 2019-01-15 11:57 PM pelmetman - 2019-01-15 11:38 PM Bulletguy - 2019-01-15 11:35 PM pelmetman - 2019-01-15 11:26 PM Barryd999 - 2019-01-15 11:22 PM pelmetman - 2019-01-15 10:53 PM Barryd999 - 2019-01-15 8:59 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-15 7:42 PM Barryd999 - 2019-01-15 4:42 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-15 4:10 PM Barryd999 - 2019-01-15 1:37 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-15 12:01 PM What exactly are you doubting ??? Is it the Sunderland Echo ??? ... Maybe the "thick as mince" Sunderland lot don't fall for the misery forecasts you do Well I seem to remember posting something from the Sunderland Echo and another Poll on Sunderland not long ago that reported a shift to remain so one of them is complete bollox. It might be right Antony who knows? I watched a BBC clip just now in the gym where they talked to people in Great Yarmouth about Brexit and how they feel now two and a half years later and most of them were adamant as ever but just didnt have a fecking clue about any of it. It was like we had gone back in a time machine to June 2016 or a bit like being at the Panto where your shouting out that the villain is behind you but the dim idiot on stage cannot see him. I honestly think these people have no more idea about what Brexit means now than they did back in 2016. A second referendum and a new campaign though would perhaps focus their minds a bit and perhaps bring them up to speed. Places like Sunderland and Great Yarmouth will just sink under a no deal Brexit or probably any kind of Brexit. If all that sounds a bit condescending then I wont be apologising. I said over two years ago I felt sorry for people in those towns and cities that voted to make themselves poorer after being fed a raft of lies and promises of Unicorns. If they havent bothered to get up to speed and realise what they are about do to themselves and their towns by supporting a no deal Brexit then thats their lookout. Very condescending yes ... You base your Sunderland will be poorer theory on you being correct on all things Brexit but with respect you've not got a great track record for that on here regarding Brexit Examples please. Where do you want me to start Barry , the very beginning and how you told us we would be in the sh!t immediately after the vote We are in the s**t! Next. Look on the bright side ;-) ........There's a recession coming and you'll be able to blame it on Brexit :D ............ Germany's already in recession, and no doubt that's Brexits fault? >:-) ......... Well if its coming anyway as has already been said, its probably not a good idea to put ourselves in a much weaker position beforehand is it? We are already between £400-500m a week worse off and we havent left yet. If those economic forecasts are even remotely accurate about the No Deal Brexit you desire and we have to cope with a further down turn as well then I guess the sunlit uplands aint happening. You shouldn't believe that Remoaner propaganda bilge Barry *-) .......... My reports from the coalface say that the UK PLC is doing very nicely B-) .......... Plus our gdp is still growing .......unlike some other EU countries >:-) ......... Your "coalface" has just suffered a massive shaft collapse......the worst defeat in history. *-) Nope.......the coalface I refer to are people who run businesses in the soft furnishings sector, the kind of businesses that would be the first to notice any slow down ;-) ........... I don't think puffs and curtains is enough to keep the country from going to hell in a handbasket. How about you go and talk to some of those thousands of car workers faced with losing their jobs and see what they think of your 'coalface report'? Soft furnishings are a non essential purchase ;-) ........... So from experience I know when the country is in recession :-| ......... With regard to the car industry that is in terminal decline in its present form regardless of Brexit *-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-15 7:50 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-15 9:37 AM Seems Brexit Barry is confused ... Despite telling us constantly how folk didn't know what they were voting for it now seems the good people of Sunderland who voted by 60% to leave now they are better informed would according to the latest Sunderland Echo poll vote by 70% to leave with no deal ... Oooops So why did they vote Brexit, Antony? You seem to understand, but I still don't get it. Can you explain, for a bear of very little brain, please? No-one ever seems to want to say. If I knew, I might even begin to understand. Well, understand this Brian: Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it. If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU. Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope. You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position. Something doesn’t add up 747. Why the influx of EU citizens, are they all on the dole? Here’s an article I found on what the EU has done for the North East. I am not denying that the decline of heavy industry hit the NE hard but will exiting the EU make anything better. Seems not if you read the article. And before you observe that I am one of the privileged Southerners I come from Scunthorpe originally and my dad was a steelworker and lost his job back in the 70s. https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/what-european-union-ever-done-11480870 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 9:21 AM 747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-15 7:50 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-15 9:37 AM Seems Brexit Barry is confused ... Despite telling us constantly how folk didn't know what they were voting for it now seems the good people of Sunderland who voted by 60% to leave now they are better informed would according to the latest Sunderland Echo poll vote by 70% to leave with no deal ... Oooops So why did they vote Brexit, Antony? You seem to understand, but I still don't get it. Can you explain, for a bear of very little brain, please? No-one ever seems to want to say. If I knew, I might even begin to understand. Well, understand this Brian: Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it. If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU. Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope. You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position. Something doesn’t add up 747. Why the influx of EU citizens, are they all on the dole? Here’s an article I found on what the EU has done for the North East. I am not denying that the decline of heavy industry hit the NE hard but will exiting the EU make anything better. Seems not if you read the article. And before you observe that I am one of the privileged Southerners I come from Scunthorpe originally and my dad was a steelworker and lost his job back in the 70s. https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/what-european-union-ever-done-11480870 Seems more like a list of where the EU spent OUR money *-) ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Yes indeed Dave, in our country. The big question remains, will the North East continue to receive this kind of support post Brexit and that will largely depend on there being enough money in the public coffers to fund it. A more prosperous UK is not what I see on the horizon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 9:55 AM Yes indeed Dave, in our country. The big question remains, will the North East continue to receive this kind of support post Brexit and that will largely depend on there being enough money in the public coffers to fund it. A more prosperous UK is not what I see on the horizon. Seeing as the NE received just a fraction of the money we gave to the EU, I suspect we'll be quids in when we leave B-) ............. Although the bill for treating Remoaners PTSD could be expensive 8-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 9:55 AM Yes indeed Dave, in our country. The big question remains, will the North East continue to receive this kind of support post Brexit and that will largely depend on there being enough money in the public coffers to fund it. A more prosperous UK is not what I see on the horizon. While we have been in the EU we have paid a lot of money into the EU - and some of it has been spent in the North of England. After we leave the EU we won't be sending any more money to the EU - so it will all be available for investment in the South of England. :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 malc d - 2019-01-16 10:18 AM Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 9:55 AM Yes indeed Dave, in our country. The big question remains, will the North East continue to receive this kind of support post Brexit and that will largely depend on there being enough money in the public coffers to fund it. A more prosperous UK is not what I see on the horizon. While we have been in the EU we have paid a lot of money into the EU - and some of it has been spent in the North of England. After we leave the EU we won't be sending any more money to the EU - so it will all be available for investment in the South of England. :-| So long as its not spent in London ;-) ........... Its high time the UK taxpayers money was spent on the UK B-) .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
747 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 9:21 AM 747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-15 7:50 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-15 9:37 AM Seems Brexit Barry is confused ... Despite telling us constantly how folk didn't know what they were voting for it now seems the good people of Sunderland who voted by 60% to leave now they are better informed would according to the latest Sunderland Echo poll vote by 70% to leave with no deal ... Oooops So why did they vote Brexit, Antony? You seem to understand, but I still don't get it. Can you explain, for a bear of very little brain, please? No-one ever seems to want to say. If I knew, I might even begin to understand. Well, understand this Brian: Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it. If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU. Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope. You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position. Something doesn’t add up 747. Why the influx of EU citizens, are they all on the dole? Here’s an article I found on what the EU has done for the North East. I am not denying that the decline of heavy industry hit the NE hard but will exiting the EU make anything better. Seems not if you read the article. And before you observe that I am one of the privileged Southerners I come from Scunthorpe originally and my dad was a steelworker and lost his job back in the 70s. https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/what-european-union-ever-done-11480870 The Eu Citizens are actually quite hardworking. This can be seen by the explosion of kebab shops run by Eastern Europeans and staffed by asylum speakers. The profits financing rundown properties rented out to Eastern Europeans working in the numerous Car Washes. Yeah, I am going a bit over the top but there is some truth in that. *-) We have what is probably an average amount of incomers from the EU and rest of the World. On the few occasions that I have had to attend A&E in the past few years, the waiting area largely comprised these people. I am just giving an observation here, not a Political statement (although I have been called racist umpteen times on forums for stating that I voted leave). If I was Romanian, Lithuanian or even Albanian (and yes, some have false papers) I would jump at the chance of a move to the UK for myself and my family if it meant an improvement in my living standards and to get away from genuine racism (as in the case of the Roma people). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 pelmetman - 2019-01-16 10:20 AM So long as its not spent in London ;-) ........... Its high time the UK taxpayers money was spent on the UK B-) .......... You can bet your life that London will get priority ( such as HS2 so Londoners can get to Birmingham a bit quicker ). Don't hold your breath for equal distribution of funds around the country. :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 So it seems like a lot of them set up small marginal businesses 747. A bit like my dad who bought a flat bed lorry when he was made redundant and became a "totter" of sorts, necessity being the mother of invention. What you say about A&E departments chimes with my own experience as our nearest hospital is situation in an area which has a large influx of migrants from the EU and outside the EU and Ive visited recently with very poorly relatives. I don't see you as having been racist at all. We have to face facts- there have been disadvantages associated with free movement which cannot all be put down to a failure of government. It seems likely from both yours and my experience that some migrants don't understand the role of A&E departments, though it's true some Brits don't either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted January 16, 2019 Author Share Posted January 16, 2019 Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 antony1969 - 2019-01-16 12:03 PM Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners Ever the xenophobe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-15 7:50 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-15 9:37 AM Seems Brexit Barry is confused ... Despite telling us constantly how folk didn't know what they were voting for it now seems the good people of Sunderland who voted by 60% to leave now they are better informed would according to the latest Sunderland Echo poll vote by 70% to leave with no deal ... Oooops So why did they vote Brexit, Antony? You seem to understand, but I still don't get it. Can you explain, for a bear of very little brain, please? No-one ever seems to want to say. If I knew, I might even begin to understand. Well, understand this Brian: Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it. If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU. Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope. You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position. Its not just Nissan though is it? The North East is the only net exporter in the UK and as result stands to be the worst hit with a predicted 16% drop in GDP in a no deal Brexit according to the governments own figures. For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. So I have seen first hand how that region ticks at least from an SME point of view and I lived in Darlington most of my life so Ive seen what recession and massive unemployment can do although it never effected me personally. With all that knowledge its as clear as day to me what Brexit will do to that region that has always seemed to be crawling out of a hole only for something or someone to stomp on its fingers as it reaches the top so it has to start again. Newcastle city centre is fantastic now as are many areas that were once total s**t holes. Remember what much of it was like in the early 80s where ironically many went off to look for work abroad. It did give the world the best comedy series of all time though, Auf Wiedersehen Pet! For the record, Ive never thought upon you as being "thick as mince" (lol) Stew or an onion soup perhaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 1:58 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-16 12:03 PM Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners Ever the xenophobe. He's prolly right though isn't he Veronica?...........seeing as back in 2011 Brits barely made up more than 50% of London's population :-| ........... I guess that makes me a xenophobe to? ;-) ............ A xenophobe that chooses to spend 5 months of the year surrounded by funny foreigners :D ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. . Correction OUR MONEY ;-) ............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
747 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 There is no need to call me stewpid Barry. 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM..................Well, understand this Brian: Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it. If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU. Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope. You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position. OK, so now explain to me how those events relate to membership of the EU, and how leaving the EU will make the north east more prosperous. But please try to do so without making so many simplistic assumptions about other people based merely on where they live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted January 16, 2019 Author Share Posted January 16, 2019 Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 1:58 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-16 12:03 PM Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners Ever the xenophobe.[/quote London's not full of foreigners ??? ... It's a lie is it ??? ... I'm not ashamed to say I would prefer to spend our UK money on UK pensioners , hospitals , military , police , prisons etc ... If that makes me a xenophobe in your book Veronica I'll wear that as a badge of honour ... Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 1:58 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-16 12:03 PM Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners Ever the xenophobe. He's prolly right though isn't he Veronica?...........seeing as back in 2011 Brits barely made up more than 50% of London's population :-| ........... I guess that makes me a xenophobe to? ;-) ............ A xenophobe that chooses to spend 5 months of the year surrounded by funny foreigners :D ......… Dave, it might well make you a xenophobe, unless you start to read and check some of the random Daily Mail "statistics" you pick out and quote! :-| 2014 figure for Greater London population? 8.6 million. Not born in UK? 3 million. So, about 35% (and not nearly 50%) born outside the UK. Of those 35%: 40% were from the EU, and 60% non-EU. 40% of 3 million = 1.2 million - for which the EU might be held responsible (but you'd have to determine who actually let them in, and why. See below). That leaves 1.8 million from the rest of the world, for whose presence the EU cannot be blamed. So, who let them in? :-) Now, back to those 1.2 million from the EU. Many will have come from the post 2004 enlargement (which the UK championed), on which all EU states except the UK imposed legally permissible migration restrictions. So, UK government refusal to apply permissible controls, and not the EU, is the culprit there - which is also true for all of the non-EU migrants. Why do they come? Because they see job opportunities, and/or are recruited. Who by? UK employers. How do they get through the border? Because UK employers persuade government that they need the extra labour. So who is really responsible? Your business owning neighbour. So, don't leave the EU, go out and persecute your local businesses for employing migrants, or better still, go out and get a job with one of the businesses yourself and stop a migrant - as you're so bothered by them! :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:12 PM Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. . Correction OUR MONEY ;-) ............ Well it is and it isn't., its way more complex than that. If you believed any of the stuff put out by the remain campaign in 2016 we get ten times back in terms of trade, jobs, investment etc by being members than what we pay in. Of course you wont believe any of that, you just look at the bottom line of what goes out. I can tell you though from first hand experience of working on funding and funded ICT / business projects in outreach and rural areas or places like the North East the EU are far more likely to fund stuff than our government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-10 in all those places. If the economy tanks and there is even less money to fund important projects or to inject money into areas that are suffering in your post Brexit world what chance of it coming from our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party? Don't get me wrong, the EU funding schemes are as big a PIA to deal with as UK government funding schemes at times and the irony is a lot of the key areas that voted out received more EU Funding than areas that voted to remain without doubt. Trouble is most of them probably had no idea. Im pretty sure most of the businesses I helped fund had no idea where the money was coming from or cared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted January 16, 2019 Author Share Posted January 16, 2019 Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 5:45 PM pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:12 PM Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. . Correction OUR MONEY ;-) ............ Well it is and it isn't., its way more complex than that. If you believed any of the stuff put out by the remain campaign in 2016 we get ten times back in terms of trade, jobs, investment etc by being members than what we pay in. Of course you wont believe any of that, you just look at the bottom line of what goes out. I can tell you though from first hand experience of working on funding and funded ICT / business projects in outreach and rural areas or places like the North East the EU are far more likely to fund stuff than our government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-10 in all those places. If the economy tanks and there is even less money to fund important projects or to inject money into areas that are suffering in your post Brexit world what chance of it coming from our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party? Don't get me wrong, the EU funding schemes are as big a PIA to deal with as UK government funding schemes at times and the irony is a lot of the key areas that voted out received more EU Funding than areas that voted to remain without doubt. Trouble is most of them probably had no idea. Im pretty sure most of the businesses I helped fund had no idea where the money was coming from or cared. Ehhh ??? ... "our Government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-2010" ... Not a mention that was a Labour Government yet further down the rant "our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party" ... Go figure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-15 7:50 PM antony1969 - 2019-01-15 9:37 AM Seems Brexit Barry is confused ... Despite telling us constantly how folk didn't know what they were voting for it now seems the good people of Sunderland who voted by 60% to leave now they are better informed would according to the latest Sunderland Echo poll vote by 70% to leave with no deal ... Oooops So why did they vote Brexit, Antony? You seem to understand, but I still don't get it. Can you explain, for a bear of very little brain, please? No-one ever seems to want to say. If I knew, I might even begin to understand. Well, understand this Brian: Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it. That's pretty difficult to believe given the population of Sunderland and the millions it cost to build the factory. Your rates must have gone stratospheric into the thousands per annum? The 800 acres of land alone to build on was £1.45 million though that was helped by Thatchers government selling greenfield to Nissan at knockdown agricultural land costs (try doing that to build a private house on). I can't source any figures for the actual factory building and fitting out costs but we must be talking many millions. Are you seriously suggesting Sunderland rate payers funded "most of it" and therefore "paid for it"? According to one of your local newspapers it seems EU membership has done quite a lot for the North East. https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/what-european-union-ever-done-11480870 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
747 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Brian Kirby - 2019-01-16 2:58 PM 747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM..................Well, understand this Brian: Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it. If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU. Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope. You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position. OK, so now explain to me how those events relate to membership of the EU, and how leaving the EU will make the north east more prosperous. But please try to do so without making so many simplistic assumptions about other people based merely on where they live. I will explain in one short paragraph. The doom and gloom merchants say that a no deal Brexit will impoverish and set this country back for 20 years. I expect that if it is true, East Sussex will be affected also. Welcome to my World Brian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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