Talking your Motorhome out

[John52]

pelmetman - 2020-05-15 5:45 PM

 

 

Most of the carparks in Weymouth and Portland are closed :-| .........

 

Those that are open get a regular visit from the local plod ;-) .......

 

Just sayin......to save folks the journey :D .......

 

 

Why go on English car parks when its free to park on the road?

Especially during a pandemic with common contact surfaces on the Pay & Display machines.

I've had several nights out in Weymouth but never been on their car parks

I just use those in Scotland, Wales and the rest of Europe that are free :-D

 

In any case whats the problem with being visited by the local plod?

The only suggestion I have heard that a night away in a motorhome is actually illegal was a post by Solwaybuggier on the Covid Changes thread

QUOTE: 'any suggestion of a night away is clearly against the regulations'

I would be very interested to know what regulations it is 'clearly against', as I have been unable to find any

Has anyone else?

I'm talking about regulations - not statements made by politicians or even police officers which have sometimes been shown to be without foundation. Such that the CPS is now being forced to review some of the fines issued.

Sorry to labour the point, but its important to anyone using a motorhome!

 

[Don636]

This is taken from the latest regs on gov.uk:

 

1.9 Are day trips and holidays ok? Can people stay in second homes?

 

Day trips to outdoor open space, in a private vehicle, are permitted. You should practise social distancing from other people outside your household.

 

Leaving your home - the place you live - to stay at another home for a holiday or other purpose is not allowed. This includes visiting second homes.

 

Premises such as hotels and bed and breakfasts will remain closed, except where providing accommodation for specific reasons set out in law, such as for critical workers where required for a reason relating to their work.

 

Nothing about. Motorhomes or caravans specifically but I reckon that staying in one would fall foul of this advice.

 

Also from the The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (England) Regulations 2020

 

Restrictions on movement

 

6.—(1) During the emergency period, no person may leave [F8or be outside of] the place where they are living without reasonable excuse.

 

(2) For the purposes of paragraph (1), a reasonable excuse includes the need—

 

(a)to obtain basic necessities, including food and medical supplies for those in the same household (including any pets or animals in the household) or for vulnerable persons and supplies for the essential upkeep, maintenance and functioning of the household, or the household of a vulnerable person, F9... including from any business listed in Part 3 of Schedule 2;

 

[F10(aa)to obtain money from or deposit money with any business listed in paragraphs 33 or 34 of Schedule 2;]

 

[F11(ab)to collect goods which have been ordered from a business in any way permitted under regulation 5(1)(a);]

 

[F12(b)to take exercise—

 

(i)alone,

(ii)with one or more members of their household, or

(iii)with one member of another household;]

 

[F13(ba)to visit a public open space for the purposes of open-air recreation to promote their physical or mental health or emotional wellbeing—

 

(i)alone,

(ii)with one or more members of their household, or

(iii)with one member of another household

 

It seems clear that you are only allowed to leave home for exercise or to visit a public space for open air recreation. Nothing about traveling away from home to stay in another home or a motorhome.

 

I think it is pretty clear that staying out overnight in a motorhome is not allowed but if you don’t agree on you go and test it yourself and let us know how you get on.

[Agaric]

The car park at the nature reserve in my lane has now been opened, but I think that's about as far opening up is going for a few weeks yet.

 

Until there is a clear message that it is OK for campsites to open, we can take it as read that it's not OK to go swaning about the country in motorhomes for days on end.

 

I know it's frustrating, especially like me who can see ones means of escape sitting in the yard on our farm, I just keep saying to myself "maybe September".

[BruceM]

In reality although the law of the land is absolute, people’s convenient interpretation of it seems to determine what happens on an everyday basis and to some extent what many people find acceptable behaviour.

 

Bearing in mind that there’s a perception that Covid-10 mortality is predominantly an issue for old people and bearing in mind that many people are struggling both with the social aspects of the lockdown, and a lack of income because they’re prevented from working, then the latest relaxation of the lockdown will be undoubtedly interpreted beyond it’s legal intent.

 

So for instance, talking on Saturday with someone I know in North Devon he tells me that they’ve been told that the children will go back to school on 1st June (two weeks time) and that many shops on gov.uk’s restriction list have either opened or are in the process of opening. The rationale for the latter being that gov.uk guidance states that we should work from home but if we cannot then we should go into work if we can do so safely. Consequently many small retailers regard that as the green light to go into work and open up their shops. There may well be some motorhome storage facilities and campsites following suit. Illegal of course. We shall see if there’s any enforcement.

 

As a result, I think that if you motorhome overnight unobtrusively in the street somewhere and no one complains you’ll get away with it. If you’re 101’d then the police will most probably feel obliged to pay you a visit and ask you to move on, or if their policy is otherwise, issue a fine.

[globebuster]

John52 - 2020-05-17 5:06 PM

 

pelmetman - 2020-05-15 5:45 PM

 

 

Most of the carparks in Weymouth and Portland are closed :-| .........

 

Those that are open get a regular visit from the local plod ;-) .......

 

Just sayin......to save folks the journey :D .......

 

 

Why go on English car parks when its free to park on the road?

Especially during a pandemic with common contact surfaces on the Pay & Display machines.

I've had several nights out in Weymouth but never been on their car parks

I just use those in Scotland, Wales and the rest of Europe that are free :-D

 

In any case whats the problem with being visited by the local plod?

The only suggestion I have heard that a night away in a motorhome is actually illegal was a post by Solwaybuggier on the Covid Changes thread

QUOTE: 'any suggestion of a night away is clearly against the regulations'

I would be very interested to know what regulations it is 'clearly against', as I have been unable to find any

Has anyone else?

I'm talking about regulations - not statements made by politicians or even police officers which have sometimes been shown to be without foundation. Such that the CPS is now being forced to review some of the fines issued.

Sorry to labour the point, but its important to anyone using a motorhome!

 

I too apologies for labouring the point -

 

But you John have been flouting the law and have travelled far and wide during the lockdown - by your own admission.

You have travelled from Scotland to the West Country and have been there for weeks. Certainly not just an odd night.

 

I would say you are clearly breaking the law, and the ethos of why we are doing it to protect society as a whole.

 

And before you say it - self isolating in a motorhome, is not an acceptable get-out clause.

 

Indeed, travelling out of Scotland would imply that you have already broached the law in the country you should still be residing in.

[Don636]

The subject of flouting Coronavirus rules is an interesting one. I suppose you could try to make an argument that you can self isolate in a motorhome as it is self contained and maybe you could for a couple of days but after that surely you need to get water, dump waste, buy food etc which puts you at risk of catching or spreading the virus so it can’t be possible to self isolate for longer than that. Regardless, the law surrounding lockdown and the stay at home requirement is perfectly clear. To deliberately flout these laws is to show a complete disregard for the safety of yourself and, more importantly, others in the community.

 

On the other hand people do ignore laws if they feel they are willing to accept the risks involved, be it injury to themselves and/or others or a fine and/or jail time. As an example, how many of us can say they never break the speed limits, which you could argue is the same thing as breaking the Coronavirus laws. Why then do we feel it is OK to regularly flout speed limits but not to go out and about in a motorhome at the moment? I often break speed limits, sometimes by a few MPH, sometimes by a lot but I have stuck rigidly to the Coronavirus rules. Why is that? I reckon it must be that even though I know I am breaking the law by speeding and it is dangerous I still (mistakingly?) feel in control and that the risk is small as I have not had an accident for decades whereas I think (possibly mistakingly?) that the risk of catching Coronavirus is higher than I feel comfortable with despite me taking all reasonable precautions. Also, there is not a lot of stigma attached to a bit of speeding as we all do it to some extent whereas there will probably be a lot of stigma attached to flouting Coronavirus laws so peer pressure comes into play.

 

At the end of the day it is down to your own conscience as to whether or not you comply with the Coronavirus laws and guidance as I doubt the fines involved will do it.

 

None of us are perfect but stay safe and preferably, stay at home as much as you can seems best I think - not too much to ask really.

 

 

[John52]

Don636 - 2020-05-17 8:35 PM

 

Regardless, the law surrounding lockdown and the stay at home requirement is perfectly clear. To deliberately flout these laws is to show a complete disregard for the safety of yourself and, more importantly, others in the community.

 

 

 

 

You still have to go out for food, exercise etc if you are in a bricks and mortar home - and you don't have the option to move to a less congested area to do it.

It isn't people self isolating in motorhomes that have given Britain the highest deaths in Europe,

But it would help the Government to pretend that it is.

 

[Don636]

If you tour around in a motorhome at the moment you are breaking the law - fact, but as I said what you do is down to you and your own conscience and I have no interest in trying to argue the rights and wrongs of it with you and it is of no interest to me what you chose to do. Stay safe though.

[whiskers]

Copy from the Government information.

Essential travel does not include visits to second homes, camp sites, caravan parks or similar, whether for isolation purposes or holidays. People must remain in their primary residence. Not taking these steps puts additional pressure on communities and services that are already at risk.

[Don636]

Thanks Whiskers, I missed that one but checked again and I can see where you got it - very specific to us and absolutely clear although no doubt someone will come along and say they are not visiting a campsite so it does not apply as they are parked up in a field or some such.

[jumpstart]

Except of corse if your primary residence IS your Motorhome then you CAN drive to the shops or go out in the countryside. There are plenty of people who either live permanently in a Motorhome or who have sold their house prior to the lockdown and now reside in the Motorhome. Isolating in a house or a Motorhome still requires shopping,or driving.

[thebishbus]

Don't forget, John 52 thinks he can get away it because his converted white van does not look like a motorhome. This enables him to drive around and park in residential streets unchallenged

Brian B.

[John52]

Don636 - 2020-05-17 5:26 PM

go and test it yourself and let us know how you get on.

 

Well I have done, and have had no bother. But since my van does not look like a motorhome till I open the side door, my experience is probably not relevant to you. I keep the side door closed when parking overnight on a residential street, and look for places that don't invite trouble. Avoiding streets where parking is scarce and fought over. Typically I would park outside an apartment block where the residents have their private parking so don't need the street, nobody knows who the van belongs to, or who is watching it from their window if anyone were to interfere with it. Getting their late, sleeping, and leaving early.

Then I open the side door and sit in my armchair looking out when I get down to the seafront (early before the spaces are gone) The people there are overwhelmingly visitors and day trippers who are always friendly and positive, and think its a great idea - especially now with the public toilets and most of the food outlets closed. So I have no shortage of friendly people to talk to (except when its this early so they aren't here yet)

Police were here yesterday, but they weren't interested in me - just the p*ssheads congregating close together on the beach.

The people who are hostile to us are a few selfish nimbys who seem to think our public roads and parks are their personal property, but especially the local businesses who have control of the local council who would have us forced to eat in their establishments and sleep in their grotty beds instead of bringing our own.

They have always been hostile to motorhomes, Covid19 has just given them another excuse - despite the fact that visiting in a self contained motorhome is the safest way to avoid catching or spreading the virus.

However crowded the seafront gets I can self isolate in here, or move on to somewhere less crowded.

The virus will take off again when they open their establishments - especially where alcohol causes people to lose their common sense about social distancing like it did yesterday, but at least they were outdoors (on the beach) where the virus doesn't spread so easily.

So my conscience is clear, and I don't care what they think of me :-D - why should I care what they think of me when I've got everything I want and don't want anything from them.

I've seen very few motorhomes out so far, but there are some. Mostly parked up in isolated lay bys. But a few in the seaside resorts, often with notices in their windows explaining why people are self isolating in them. And a few which look un occupied, so might belong to local residents who have no off road parking.

[spospe]

To update things, I took my 'van for its hab service, a round trip of 52 miles and experienced no problems of any kind. I passed several police cars and was briefly followed by one, but no reactions at all. This was all in the south Manchester / Cheshire Plain area and at the time, traffic was, 'light'.

[globebuster]

John52 - 2020-05-21 6:45 AM

 

Don636 - 2020-05-17 5:26 PM

go and test it yourself and let us know how you get on.

 

Well I have done, and have had no bother. But since my van does not look like a motorhome till I open the side door, my experience is probably not relevant to you. I keep the side door closed when parking overnight on a residential street, and look for places that don't invite trouble. Avoiding streets where parking is scarce and fought over. Typically I would park outside an apartment block where the residents have their private parking so don't need the street, nobody knows who the van belongs to, or who is watching it from their window if anyone were to interfere with it. Getting their late, sleeping, and leaving early.

Then I open the side door and sit in my armchair looking out when I get down to the seafront (early before the spaces are gone) The people there are overwhelmingly visitors and day trippers who are always friendly and positive, and think its a great idea - especially now with the public toilets and most of the food outlets closed. So I have no shortage of friendly people to talk to (except when its this early so they aren't here yet)

Police were here yesterday, but they weren't interested in me - just the p*ssheads congregating close together on the beach.

The people who are hostile to us are a few selfish nimbys who seem to think our public roads and parks are their personal property, but especially the local businesses who have control of the local council who would have us forced to eat in their establishments and sleep in their grotty beds instead of bringing our own.

They have always been hostile to motorhomes, Covid19 has just given them another excuse - despite the fact that visiting in a self contained motorhome is the safest way to avoid catching or spreading the virus.

However crowded the seafront gets I can self isolate in here, or move on to somewhere less crowded.

The virus will take off again when they open their establishments - especially where alcohol causes people to lose their common sense about social distancing like it did yesterday, but at least they were outdoors (on the beach) where the virus doesn't spread so easily.

So my conscience is clear, and I don't care what they think of me :-D - why should I care what they think of me when I've got everything I want and don't want anything from them.

I've seen very few motorhomes out so far, but there are some. Mostly parked up in isolated lay bys. But a few in the seaside resorts, often with notices in their windows explaining why people are self isolating in them. And a few which look un occupied, so might belong to local residents who have no off road parking.

 

Well John,

 

3 points worth mentioning -

 

1 - Public Toilets being closed

 

So how are you disposing of waste, grey or black?

 

2 - How are you getting water?

 

3 - What is your obsession with 'Nimbys' as you call them - in normal times I'm sure everyone would welcome anybody, but these are not normal times are they?

[i would imagine there is little hostility in normal times, but at present that might possibly be understandable]

 

By your own admission you have seen very few motorhomes - probably that's because the majority are respecting society and not breaking the law.

 

I think the statement that your 'conscience is clear' speaks volumes of your disregard for the rest of us.

 

You have already broken the law in your usual country of residence, and have continued to flout them for weeks and weeks on end.

That you continue to be on the move, increases the risk both to you and the general public - in fact your actions could not be more reckless!

Unless you have the symptoms you don't need to self isolate, and regardless of whether you do or don't you should be based at home.

 

That you have to come on here and harp on about what, and why you are doing what you do, would seem to me that you are trying to seek some justification for your actions.

 

I would imagine that for the majority who read this, that you [in the present circumstances] are actually creating any hostility to motorhomer's you so bemoan.

 

I also wonder if the 'friendly and positive' people you meet would think it was a great idea if they knew of your sanitary arrangements!

Would you like to enlighten other forum participants?

 

There is clearly little point in getting into any kind of discussion regarding your selfish actions - after all, 'you don't care' as you clearly stated.

 

But perhaps you could have the decency to not boast of your 'you don't care' law-breaking escapades, which you have done on this and many recent threads on chatterbox.

 

This is the last I shall post on the subject, my conscience is also clear, but for the polar opposite reason that I actually do care, and take some responsibility for my actions.

 

 

[John52]

globebuster - 2020-05-21 9:56 AM

 

 

I also wonder if the 'friendly and positive' people you meet would think it was a great idea if they knew of your sanitary arrangements!

 

 

 

Do you think they would be in a position to judge when they are knocking back cans of lager and all the toilets are closed *-)

The locals who came along after they had gone were not tut-tutting at me.

They were looking in the other direction and tut-tutting at all the empty cans and bottles left on the beach :-S

[Keithl]

All,

 

This thread has now run it's course and degenerated into Chatterbox style slanging matches so I am going to freeze it.

 

Sorry to anyone who thought it was useful.

 

Keith.