John52 Posted March 28, 2021 Author Share Posted March 28, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-03-28 9:29 AM Unfortunately for you LOSERS ;-) ......... The EU is proving exactly why we Brexiteers were right >:-) .......... The fact that you refuse to accept the evidence says more about you LOSERS than it does us WINNERS (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... So you are back to Mr Hater Nasty Shouty Shouty, proving Brian right. What evidence? You talk about 'the evidence' all of which you have presented has been proven to be false, but you still come back with it. Why won't you say what you have really got against the EU? Or is it just that you have been suckered into believing the Brexiteers lies and won't admit it? Millions of others were suckered like you, and you could at least recover some credibility by being honest and admitting it like many of them have. Instead of trying to shout everyone down with insults. That just makes you look foolish AND nasty. Instead of just foolish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 John52 - 2021-03-28 9:55 AM pelmetman - 2021-03-28 9:29 AM Unfortunately for you LOSERS ;-) ......... The EU is proving exactly why we Brexiteers were right >:-) .......... The fact that you refuse to accept the evidence says more about you LOSERS than it does us WINNERS (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... So you are back to Mr Hater Nasty Shouty Shouty, proving Brian right. What evidence? You talk about 'the evidence' all of which you have presented has been proven to be false, but you still come back with it. Why won't you say what you have really got against the EU? Or is it just that you have been suckered into believing the Brexiteers lies and won't admit it? Millions of others were suckered like you, and you could at least recover some credibility by being honest and admitting it like many of them have. Instead of trying to shout everyone down with insults. That just makes you look foolish AND nasty. Instead of just foolish. If you dont believe me ;-) .........Ask our neighbours >:-) ........ "Read the cries of despair from every corner of the EU over the jab rollout fiasco - as cases soar amid the Continent's third wave IRELAND It’s so frustrating being six miles from the UK border but not having the vaccine Ireland Number jabbed 515,800; % of population 10.4% Corrinna Maguire thinks Brussels has let all of Europe down Five thousand long-term care residents still haven’t had a jab. Despite hopes of getting 827,000 AstraZeneca doses by the end of March, based on advance purchase agreements, Ireland has had only 228,000. Just 10.39 people per 100 have received the jab. Aaron Daly, 43, a photographer from Dun Laoghaire, said: ‘I blame the government for failing to put in place the necessary logistics for the rollout. ‘Our health service has again shown failings in communication and organisation.’ His wife is a full-time carer to their daughter who has special needs. Neither has been allocated a vaccination and he says: ‘It could be months before our daughter is vaccinated. ‘I have family in the North, so am very aware how much quicker the rollout has been there. ‘Family carers in Northern Ireland and the UK were prioritised, which makes so much sense.’ Siobhan O’Hara, 51, a part-time carer from Manorhamilton, Co Leitrim, said: ‘I am very disappointed – both with the limited amount of vaccines and the speed of the rollout. ‘Initially, I blame the EU Commission. Like anyone purchasing a product, they should have had complete transparency and official confirmation of quantities and delivery date assurances from AstraZeneca.’ Her mother needs full-time care and has only recently had the jab. Corrinna Maguire, 43, a general manager from Glenboy Co Leitrim, said: ‘Our government is to blame. It should have organised the purchase of the vaccine better. Also, Brussels seems to have let the whole of Europe down on not securing enough vaccines quick enough. ‘The rollout across the UK and Northern Ireland is excellent. Other countries should follow suit. It’s frustrating living six miles from the border and not being able to get the vaccine.’ For days, our doctor’s surgery has been flooded with desperate calls for the jab FRANCE Daily cases 41,869 Number jabbed 7.2m, % of population 10.6% First, President Emmanuel Macron dismissed the AstraZeneca vaccine as ‘quasi-ineffective’ in people over-65. Then opinion polls suggested that up to 60 per cent of French people do not want the vaccine. Marc Droguet says the jab rollout race is not a rugby match Adding to the problem, the authorities suspended use of the AZ jab over fears of blood clots. Finally, that decision was overturned but health officials ruled that only people aged 55 and over should get the AstraZeneca vaccine. France has inoculated only 10.6 people in every 100. Francoise Durand, a GP in the Morbihan department in Brittany, says: ‘I have people crying out for vaccines and been flooded with desperate calls. I’ve appealed to the Ministry but there has been insufficient communication. ‘Today, I have ten doses available but there are 100 or more people waiting.There is very little faith in the government. People point the finger at Macron and say he has admitted that he has failed them. It is intolerable in a country like ours which prides itself on the excellence of its health service.’ Retired Breton farmer Franck Lelievre spoke to the MoS while waiting at a surgery for a jab. He said: ‘I’m worried because I have a heart condition and high blood pressure. If I get Covid, it’s probably curtains for me. ‘I’ve been asking for a jab for weeks. There just haven’t been any available. Hopefully this morning I’ll get one. ‘You English seem to be ahead of France. Maybe it’s something to do with Brexit.’ Sylvie, a 49-year-old shop assistant, said: ‘It’s a national scandal. We’ve been living with this evil virus for a year. Finally they’ve developed an antidote but we can’t get it.’ Marc Droguet, deputy mayor of Redon, a town of 11,000 inhabitants, said: ‘Yes, we are behind England but this is not a a rugby match. There are no winners and losers. In the EU, we must work together to solve this crisis together. That’s what Europe is about. Whereas the English see fit to go it alone, we prefer to work together. Together we stand. Divided we fall. I’m very envious of how things are a lot better handled in the UK SPAIN Daily cases: 7,586 Number jabbed 4.6m, % of population 9.8% Carer Oscar Martinez praises UK politicians for our jab rollout Halted use of AstraZeneca for eight days, resulting in a stockpile of 735,652 doses. Initially, one of 11 EU countries that refused to recommend AZ for the elderly. It’s estimated that only 50 per cent of those aged 80 and over have been vaccinated. Retired shoe buyer Jesus Blesa, 66, who lives in the Costa Blanca town of Torrevieja has not yet been jabbed. ‘I don’t know when I’ll get mine. It just goes to show you how slow things are here,’ he said. ‘I know things are a lot better in England and I’m envious. ‘Spain is on the verge of a third wave which would be devastating if it means another summer without foreign tourists.’ Aroa Silgado, 36, from San Sebastian, suffers from the autoimmune disease Myositis, which inflames and weakens muscle fibres. She said: ‘I’m in a high-risk group and coronavirus could be a death sentence for me but I’ve yet to receive my first jab and I have no idea how long I’ll have to wait. There seems to be very little co-ordination at European level.’ She says she wrote to the Spanish Prime Minister, saying it was a ‘disgrace’ that she is still waiting for a vaccine. She got a reply saying the health ministry was ‘following protocols based on age and occupation. I have a friend in England who says they’re prioritising people according to their needs. That should happen here.’ Refuse collector Jose Francisco Martinez, 46, says: ‘My dad is 79 and my mum 73 and neither have been jabbed. I admire the way Britain is responding.’ Photographer Joaquin Carreon, 61, from Torrevieja, says: “The vaccine problem here is definitely a European problem. You can understand why people in the UK are happy they voted for Brexit.’ Oscar Martinez, 55, who cares full-time for his mum in Miranda de Ebro near Burgos, northern Spain, said: ‘British politicians have been more on the ball.’ With an Anglo-Saxon mindset, Britain is better organised ITALY Daily cases: 24,076 Number jabbed: 6.2m, % of population 10.2 Coffee bar owner Giovanni Facile, 72, is still awaiting his first jab There was widespread anger last week when 29 million doses of the AstraZeneca jab destined for EU nations and poorer countries were found stockpiled in a warehouse near Rome. Latest figures show that 51 per cent of the over-80s in Italy have not yet been inoculated, nor have 95 per cent of those aged 70-79. The country also paused rollout of the AZ jab over blood clot fears. The government is now set to order the Russian Sputnik V jab. Housewife Antonia Piredda, 49, is angry that her 91-year-old mother-in-law has not yet had the jab. She says: ‘My daughter and sister-in-law, who are young but work at schools, have been vaccinated. The rollout in Italy has been seriously disorganised. The authorities still don’t know what they are doing. The health system here has always been chaotic. They can’t decide who to vaccinate first. ‘If they continue at this pace, we will never get back to normal. The UK has done well, they have executed their vaccine rollout to perfection. It would have been better to keep the vaccines here and not export them to the UK.’ Pizza restaurant owner Massimo Cappellacci says: ‘The vaccination campaign here is very behind and disorganised. It is classic Italy. ‘The main problem is supply. It’s not the fault of the region, it is the EU’s fault, as it was Brussels that organised it. ‘As our prime minister has said, if it is working, then great, otherwise Italy should go it alone.’ Gino Barrozzi, a 60-year-old sales agent, says: ‘My 87-year-old mother is just getting her jab this week. ‘It should have been done much earlier. The UK has been much faster. It would have been much faster and more intelligent of Italy to do it alone.’ Giovanni Facile, 72, owner of a coffee bar is still awaiting a jab and says ‘it’s not going to be for a while’. He explains: ‘They are giving them to other groups, such as lawyers, ahead of older people. This is how things work in Italy.’ We’ve seen bickering and petty politicking BELGIUM Daily cases: 6,123 Number jabbed: 1.2M, % of population 9.9% Belgium has 316,327 unused doses despite being home to a Pfizer’s production site in the town of Puurs. Only 10 per cent of Belgians have had a jab. Jo Verstuyft, a pharmacist in Puurs, says: ‘The Pfizer plant is just here, but I had to have an AstraZeneca vaccination made in the UK.’ Danielle Jacobs, retired, said: ‘It’s so frustrating that Belgium produces so many doses but we don’t have enough for the Belgian people.’ Eric Lemestre, a civil servant, said:‘The bickering about AstraZeneca has been as much petty politics as science.’ Just too much talk– and too few jabs NETHERLANDS Daily cases: 7,562 Number jabbed 1.5m, % of population 8.7% The government has promised everyone aged over 18 a vaccine this year. AstraZeneca’s plant in Leiden became the focus of the EU’s vaccine row with Britain after a Brussels source said doses from there ‘have to go to the EU’ despite a contract to supply Britain. The country has vaccinated 8.7 people per 100. Costis Budolas, a restaurant owner in Leiden, says: ‘The EU is collapsing. You Brits did the right thing to leave. ‘Outside the EU, you can be faster. I used to live in London. I know that trade has been affected by Brexit but I think this won’t last for long and the UK will be happy to have left within a few months.’ Ruud Mestrom, a bar and restaurant owner, said: ‘Whereas Israel’s vaccination programme worked round the clock, here it’s just from 9am to 5pm.’ Cancer sufferer Eveline van Koetsveld van Ankeron, owner of an art supplies shop, says: ‘Why do I have to wait so long for a jab? Maybe at the end of May or June I’ll get one. People who need the vaccine the most, why are they not getting it?’ Bennie, an olive oil store manager, said: ‘There’s too much talk and not enough jabbing going on. There is a lack of leadership.’ Brussels has been caught sleeping GERMANY Daily cases: 20.689 Number jabbed: 8.6M, % of population 10.3 Product manager Juliana Becker says Brussels was too hesitant After a temporary halt on using the AstraZeneca jab amid reports of blood-clot disorders in a small number of people, the country has a stockpile of 3.5 million unused doses. Only 10 per cent of Germans have had their first dose – compared with 42 per cent in Britain. The Berlin government is now considering buying doses of Russia’s Sputnik V. Jorg Wilkens, 60, a carpenter from Hanover who has heart problems, says: ‘Compared to England, things are going badly here. The EU have been asleep. Every country should have got their own vaccine. I have no idea when I will get my jab.’ Dr Arnulf Sander, 68, a GP whose wife Christiane works in his office, says: ‘England is way ahead of us. ‘Last year we started to build big vaccination centres all over the country but they are more or less empty now because we don’t have enough vaccines.’ Even when Germany’s vaccine campaign is accelerated next month, he says his surgery will only get 20 jabs a week. ‘What we need is less bureaucracy and more flexibility.’ Juliana Becker, 28, a product manager, said: ‘The EU has acted too hesitantly. It seems that Brussels started negotiations with manufacturers far too late. ‘I have friends in England who are looking forward to being vaccinated in the next couple of weeks. I don’t think we will we’ll be getting our jab any time soon.’ https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9410277/From-corner-EU-cries-despair-jab-rollout.html Yet our resident LOSERS still defend the EU 8-) .......... 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CurtainRaiser Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 So a 126,000 dead and a £126,000 of "tax payers dosh" to his mistress. Seems to me more than one inquiry is needed. https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/boris-johnson-affair-jennifer-arcuri-23798478 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 CurtainRaiser - 2021-03-28 10:15 AM So a 126,000 dead and a £126,000 of "tax payers dosh" to his mistress. Seems to me more than one inquiry is needed. https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/boris-johnson-affair-jennifer-arcuri-23798478 Yet you LOSERS are not demanding the EU has a inquiry into their handling of the Pandemic? *-) ......... You LOSERS really have LOST the plot >:-) .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 28, 2021 Author Share Posted March 28, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-03-28 10:08 AM Yet our resident LOSERS still defend the EU 8-) .......... We are still going round in circles. The Vaccine rollout is about the only thing BoJo hasn't outsourced to his cronies. Its been done by the NHS and volunteers (which was founded by a Labour Government in the face of Tory opposition) Its been proven time and again that, despite the lies from Cabinet Ministers, we could have done it all whilst remaining in the EU. But still you come back to the totally disproved claim it was due to Brexit, followed by the usual Hater Nasty Shouty Shouty insults. Is that really the best you can do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 John52 - 2021-03-28 10:28 AM pelmetman - 2021-03-28 10:08 AM Yet our resident LOSERS still defend the EU 8-) .......... We are still going round in circles. The Vaccine rollout is about the only thing BoJo hasn't outsourced to his cronies. Its been done by the NHS and volunteers (which was founded by a Labour Government in the face of Tory opposition) Its been proven time and again that, despite the lies from Cabinet Ministers, we could have done it all whilst remaining in the EU. But still you come back to the totally disproved claim it was due to Brexit, followed by the usual Hater Nasty Shouty Shouty insults. Is that really the best you can do? You can carry on swimming in that Egyptian River if you like ;-) ......... Our EU neighbours know the truth >:-) ......... https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/General-Chat/Chatterbox/Anymore-evidence-required-to-prove-Brexit-was-the-right-choice-/57876/#M686287 Suck it up HATER (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 28, 2021 Author Share Posted March 28, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-03-28 10:32 AM John52 - 2021-03-28 10:28 AM pelmetman - 2021-03-28 10:08 AM Yet our resident LOSERS still defend the EU 8-) .......... We are still going round in circles. The Vaccine rollout is about the only thing BoJo hasn't outsourced to his cronies. Its been done by the NHS and volunteers (which was founded by a Labour Government in the face of Tory opposition) Its been proven time and again that, despite the lies from Cabinet Ministers, we could have done it all whilst remaining in the EU. But still you come back to the totally disproved claim it was due to Brexit, followed by the usual Hater Nasty Shouty Shouty insults. Is that really the best you can do? You can carry on swimming in that Egyptian River if you like ;-) ......... Our EU neighbours know the truth >:-) ......... https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/General-Chat/Chatterbox/Anymore-evidence-required-to-prove-Brexit-was-the-right-choice-/57876/#M686287 Suck it up HATER (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... A simple 'Yes' would have sufficed :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-03-28 10:08 AM John52 - 2021-03-28 9:55 AM pelmetman - 2021-03-28 9:29 AM Unfortunately for you LOSERS ;-) ......... The EU is proving exactly why we Brexiteers were right >:-) .......... The fact that you refuse to accept the evidence says more about you LOSERS than it does us WINNERS (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... So you are back to Mr Hater Nasty Shouty Shouty, proving Brian right. What evidence? You talk about 'the evidence' all of which you have presented has been proven to be false, but you still come back with it. Why won't you say what you have really got against the EU? Or is it just that you have been suckered into believing the Brexiteers lies and won't admit it? Millions of others were suckered like you, and you could at least recover some credibility by being honest and admitting it like many of them have. Instead of trying to shout everyone down with insults. That just makes you look foolish AND nasty. Instead of just foolish. If you dont believe me ;-) ........ Stop cross posting.....it makes you look even more stupid than you already are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 John52 - 2021-03-28 9:55 AM pelmetman - 2021-03-28 9:29 AM Unfortunately for you LOSERS ;-) ......... The EU is proving exactly why we Brexiteers were right >:-) .......... The fact that you refuse to accept the evidence says more about you LOSERS than it does us WINNERS (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... So you are back to Mr Hater Nasty Shouty Shouty, proving Brian right. What evidence? You talk about 'the evidence' all of which you have presented has been proven to be false, but you still come back with it. Why won't you say what you have really got against the EU? Or is it just that you have been suckered into believing the Brexiteers lies and won't admit it? Millions of others were suckered like you, and you could at least recover some credibility by being honest and admitting it like many of them have. Instead of trying to shout everyone down with insults. That just makes you look foolish AND nasty. Instead of just foolish. SHOUTING silly insults at fm's is all he's got left. He could not come up with an answer to anything Brian has put to him other than admit he's "gloating" which seems very childish. Like many rabid Brexit headbangers, he has an irrational fear of the EU but unable to form any coherent debate on an issue, resorts to his shouty shouty Mr Angry calling fm's "loony lefty losers" etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-03-28 9:29 AM.............................The fact that you refuse to accept the evidence says more about you LOSERS than it does us WINNERS (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... What "evidence" FGS? Exactly what is it that "proves" the UK was right to leave the EU? In what way will the man on that famous Clapham omnibus be better off out, than he was in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 4:00 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-28 9:29 AM.............................The fact that you refuse to accept the evidence says more about you LOSERS than it does us WINNERS (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... What "evidence" FGS? Exactly what is it that "proves" the UK was right to leave the EU? In what way will the man on that famous Clapham omnibus be better off out, than he was in? It's obvious Brian. Because the UK has the National Health Service - and the EU hasn't ( because it's not a Nation ). If we had stayed in the EU - they ' prolly ' wouldn't allow us to use the NHS for pandemic purposes. :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 malc d - 2021-03-30 4:17 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 4:00 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-28 9:29 AM.............................The fact that you refuse to accept the evidence says more about you LOSERS than it does us WINNERS (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... What "evidence" FGS? Exactly what is it that "proves" the UK was right to leave the EU? In what way will the man on that famous Clapham omnibus be better off out, than he was in? It's obvious Brian. Because the UK has the National Health Service - and the EU hasn't ( because it's not a Nation ). If we had stayed in the EU - they ' prolly ' wouldn't allow us to use the NHS for pandemic purposes. :-| How sweet to see you two old duffers teaming up :D ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-03-28 10:08 AM If you dont believe me ;-) .........Ask our neighbours >:-) ....... IRELAND It’s so frustrating being six miles from the UK border but not having the vaccine Ireland: Number jabbed 515,800; % of population 10.4% 1 Aaron Daly, 43, a photographer from Dun Laoghaire, said: ‘I blame the government for failing to put in place the necessary logistics for the rollout. ‘Our health service has again shown failings in communication and organisation.’ His wife is a full-time carer to their daughter who has special needs. Neither has been allocated a vaccination and he says: ‘It could be months before our daughter is vaccinated. ‘I have family in the North, so am very aware how much quicker the rollout has been there. ‘Family carers in Northern Ireland and the UK were prioritised, which makes so much sense.’ 2 Siobhan O’Hara, 51, a part-time carer from Manorhamilton, Co Leitrim, said: ‘I am very disappointed – both with the limited amount of vaccines and the speed of the rollout. ‘Initially, I blame the EU Commission. Like anyone purchasing a product, they should have had complete transparency and official confirmation of quantities and delivery date assurances from AstraZeneca.’ Her mother needs full-time care and has only recently had the jab. 3 Corrinna Maguire, 43, a general manager from Glenboy Co Leitrim, said: ‘Our government is to blame. It should have organised the purchase of the vaccine better. Also, Brussels seems to have let the whole of Europe down on not securing enough vaccines quick enough. ‘The rollout across the UK and Northern Ireland is excellent. Other countries should follow suit. It’s frustrating living six miles from the border and not being able to get the vaccine.’ For days, our doctor’s surgery has been flooded with desperate calls for the jab FRANCE Daily cases 41,869 Number jabbed 7.2m, % of population 10.6% 4 Marc Droguet says the jab rollout race is not a rugby match 5 Francoise Durand, a GP in the Morbihan department in Brittany, says: ‘I have people crying out for vaccines and been flooded with desperate calls. I’ve appealed to the Ministry but there has been insufficient communication. ‘Today, I have ten doses available but there are 100 or more people waiting.There is very little faith in the government. People point the finger at Macron and say he has admitted that he has failed them. It is intolerable in a country like ours which prides itself on the excellence of its health service.’ 6 Retired Breton farmer Franck Lelievre spoke to the MoS while waiting at a surgery for a jab. He said: ‘I’m worried because I have a heart condition and high blood pressure. If I get Covid, it’s probably curtains for me. ‘I’ve been asking for a jab for weeks. There just haven’t been any available. Hopefully this morning I’ll get one. ‘You English seem to be ahead of France. Maybe it’s something to do with Brexit.’ 7 Sylvie, a 49-year-old shop assistant, said: ‘It’s a national scandal. We’ve been living with this evil virus for a year. Finally they’ve developed an antidote but we can’t get it.’ 8 Marc Droguet, deputy mayor of Redon, a town of 11,000 inhabitants, said: ‘Yes, we are behind England but this is not a a rugby match. There are no winners and losers. In the EU, we must work together to solve this crisis together. That’s what Europe is about. Whereas the English see fit to go it alone, we prefer to work together. Together we stand. Divided we fall. I’m very envious of how things are a lot better handled in the UK SPAIN Daily cases: 7,586. Number jabbed 4.6m, % of population 9.8% 9 Carer Oscar Martinez praises UK politicians for our jab rollout. Halted use of AstraZeneca for eight days, resulting in a stockpile of 735,652 doses. Initially, one of 11 EU countries that refused to recommend AZ for the elderly. It’s estimated that only 50 per cent of those aged 80 and over have been vaccinated. 10 Retired shoe buyer Jesus Blesa, 66, who lives in the Costa Blanca town of Torrevieja has not yet been jabbed. ‘I don’t know when I’ll get mine. It just goes to show you how slow things are here,’ he said. ‘I know things are a lot better in England and I’m envious. ‘Spain is on the verge of a third wave which would be devastating if it means another summer without foreign tourists.’ 11 Aroa Silgado, 36, from San Sebastian, suffers from the autoimmune disease Myositis, which inflames and weakens muscle fibres. She said: ‘I’m in a high-risk group and coronavirus could be a death sentence for me but I’ve yet to receive my first jab and I have no idea how long I’ll have to wait. There seems to be very little co-ordination at European level.’ She says she wrote to the Spanish Prime Minister, saying it was a ‘disgrace’ that she is still waiting for a vaccine. She got a reply saying the health ministry was ‘following protocols based on age and occupation. I have a friend in England who says they’re prioritising people according to their needs. That should happen here.’ 12 Refuse collector Jose Francisco Martinez, 46, says: ‘My dad is 79 and my mum 73 and neither have been jabbed. I admire the way Britain is responding.’ 13 Photographer Joaquin Carreon, 61, from Torrevieja, says: “The vaccine problem here is definitely a European problem. You can understand why people in the UK are happy they voted for Brexit.’ 14 Oscar Martinez, 55, who cares full-time for his mum in Miranda de Ebro near Burgos, northern Spain, said: ‘British politicians have been more on the ball.’ With an Anglo-Saxon mindset, Britain is better organised ITALY Daily cases: 24,076. Number jabbed: 6.2m, % of population 10.2 15 Coffee bar owner Giovanni Facile, 72, is still awaiting his first jab. There was widespread anger last week when 29 million doses of the AstraZeneca jab destined for EU nations and poorer countries were found stockpiled in a warehouse near Rome. 16 Housewife Antonia Piredda, 49, is angry that her 91-year-old mother-in-law has not yet had the jab. She says: ‘My daughter and sister-in-law, who are young but work at schools, have been vaccinated. The rollout in Italy has been seriously disorganised. The authorities still don’t know what they are doing. The health system here has always been chaotic. They can’t decide who to vaccinate first. ‘If they continue at this pace, we will never get back to normal. The UK has done well, they have executed their vaccine rollout to perfection. It would have been better to keep the vaccines here and not export them to the UK.’ 17 Pizza restaurant owner Massimo Cappellacci says: ‘The vaccination campaign here is very behind and disorganised. It is classic Italy. ‘The main problem is supply. It’s not the fault of the region, it is the EU’s fault, as it was Brussels that organised it. ‘As our prime minister has said, if it is working, then great, otherwise Italy should go it alone.’ Gino Barrozzi, a 60-year-old sales agent, says: ‘My 87-year-old mother is just getting her jab this week. ‘It should have been done much earlier. The UK has been much faster. It would have been much faster and more intelligent of Italy to do it alone.’ 18 Giovanni Facile, 72, owner of a coffee bar is still awaiting a jab and says ‘it’s not going to be for a while’. He explains: ‘They are giving them to other groups, such as lawyers, ahead of older people. This is how things work in Italy.’ We’ve seen bickering and petty politicking BELGIUM Daily cases: 6,123. Number jabbed: 1.2M, % of population 9.9% 19 Jo Verstuyft, a pharmacist in Puurs, says: ‘The Pfizer plant is just here, but I had to have an AstraZeneca vaccination made in the UK.’ 20 Danielle Jacobs, retired, said: ‘It’s so frustrating that Belgium produces so many doses but we don’t have enough for the Belgian people.’ 21 Eric Lemestre, a civil servant, said:‘The bickering about AstraZeneca has been as much petty politics as science.’ Just too much talk– and too few jabs NETHERLANDS Daily cases: 7,562. Number jabbed 1.5m, % of population 8.7% 22 Costis Budolas, a restaurant owner in Leiden, says: ‘The EU is collapsing. You Brits did the right thing to leave. ‘Outside the EU, you can be faster. I used to live in London. I know that trade has been affected by Brexit but I think this won’t last for long and the UK will be happy to have left within a few months.’ 23 Ruud Mestrom, a bar and restaurant owner, said: ‘Whereas Israel’s vaccination programme worked round the clock, here it’s just from 9am to 5pm.’ 24 Cancer sufferer Eveline van Koetsveld van Ankeron, owner of an art supplies shop, says: ‘Why do I have to wait so long for a jab? Maybe at the end of May or June I’ll get one. People who need the vaccine the most, why are they not getting it?’ 25 Bennie, an olive oil store manager, said: ‘There’s too much talk and not enough jabbing going on. There is a lack of leadership.’ Brussels has been caught sleeping GERMANY Daily cases: 20.689. Number jabbed: 8.6M, % of population 10.3 26 Product manager Juliana Becker says Brussels was too hesitant 27 Jorg Wilkens, 60, a carpenter from Hanover who has heart problems, says: ‘Compared to England, things are going badly here. The EU have been asleep. Every country should have got their own vaccine. I have no idea when I will get my jab.’ 28 Dr Arnulf Sander, 68, a GP whose wife Christiane works in his office, says: ‘England is way ahead of us. ‘Last year we started to build big vaccination centres all over the country but they are more or less empty now because we don’t have enough vaccines.’ Even when Germany’s vaccine campaign is accelerated next month, he says his surgery will only get 20 jabs a week. ‘What we need is less bureaucracy and more flexibility.’ 29 Juliana Becker, 28, a product manager, said: ‘The EU has acted too hesitantly. It seems that Brussels started negotiations with manufacturers far too late. ‘I have friends in England who are looking forward to being vaccinated in the next couple of weeks. I don’t think we will we’ll be getting our jab any time soon.’ Yet our resident LOSERS still defend the EU 8-) .......... I've edited the above to highlight just how many of the EU's residents are actually quoted. This was (and is) not an opinion poll, it is reportage by a notoriously selective, UK, pro Brexit, "Red Top" newspaper, which I doubt (based on precedence) would have included comments (even if it looked for any!) that favoured the EU's performance with Covid and the vaccine. A few facts. The EU has a population of just over 445 million. The seven countries whose citizens were interviewed have a combined population of 290 million (65% of the EU total). So, the "Daily Mail 29" account for precisely 0.0000065% of the EU population. Some sample!! (lol) This is not to say that those 29 people do not have entirely justified complaints, nor that there are many, many, more, with similar complaints regarding the EU's performance with Covid and the vaccines. However, the distribution and administration of the vaccines within the individual states is not controlled by the EU, but by those individual states. The EU's (self-inflicted) problem is supply. The EU Commission, in seeking to prevent a vaccine bidding war among its member states, in which the wealthier states would inevitably win out against the poorer states, resulting in the necessity to close borders across the EU to prevent virus spreading from the weak to the strong, suggested that they should take responsibility for sourcing the vaccines. The further decision was the the European Medicines Agency would also conduct all necessary testing so that what was then supplied could be distributed across all the states on a per-capita basis. Those suggestions were then accepted by the 27 member states. So far, so equitable. Like the UK (at the time still in transition, and so still bound by EU regulations), any member state could have opted out of both the supply and the approval regimes, and elected to source, approve, and distribute vaccine for their own use within their own territory. None did. The outcome proved an almighty failure for both sourcing and approval of vaccine that has resulted in a chronic shortage of, and catastrophically late delivery of, vaccine. Cynically, the Commission would have done better to stand back, leave the states to fight it out among themselves, and then try to control the resulting chaos while learning from the process and later seeking an EU wide treaty agreement designed to deal effectively with the next pandemic. But, they did not. They aimed for the stars and tragically missed by a country mile! But, the Commission was not formed, and has not become equipped, to act as the EU's NHS. It's primary reason for being was, and remains, free trade among its member states in goods and services, at which it has proved successful. So, a bad decision, taken with good intent, that has backfired humiliatingly, has left the Commission diminished. There will be a lot of grumbling and recrimination, and doubtless some heads will roll, and the next time there is a major pandemic there will probably be EU wide public health crisis management, and vaccine development and distribution, programmes in lieu of spatchcocked seat of the pants responses. So, will the Covid vaccine debacle signal the collapse of the EU? I somehow doubt it. To leave on the basis of this one, admittedly catastrophic, failure, would be to throw out the baby with the bathwater. Will the EU repeat the same mistakes next time round? I expect not. Will the result be a little humbling of the Commission, with more powers transferred to the Council and the parliament? I'd guess, probably, yes. Will Ursula von der Leyen fall on her sword or be decapitated? Maybe. Who knows? But, back to the concept of evidence, do the opinions of a justifiably disgruntled 0.0000065% of the EU's population provide evidence of the imminent demise of the EU, or represent a post hoc justification for the UK's departure? Do they hell!! (lol) On that subject, I'm just about sufficiently arrogant to propose the opposite - that had we and the EU not wasted the past five years over Brexit and instead remained as members and avoided the repeated elections and resultant catastrophe of Johnson's government, we would have contributed to a much better organised response to the virus across the whole EU. Sorry its long, but you can't get quarts into pint pots, can you? :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 malc d - 2021-03-30 4:17 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 4:00 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-28 9:29 AM.............................The fact that you refuse to accept the evidence says more about you LOSERS than it does us WINNERS (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... What "evidence" FGS? Exactly what is it that "proves" the UK was right to leave the EU? In what way will the man on that famous Clapham omnibus be better off out, than he was in? It's obvious Brian. Because the UK has the National Health Service - and the EU hasn't ( because it's not a Nation ). If we had stayed in the EU - they ' prolly ' wouldn't allow us to use the NHS for pandemic purposes. :-| Its been said a number of times before Malc, but at the time the UK decisions on UK vaccine supply and approval were being made we were still in the transition period, and so still subject to EU regulation. That has been confirmed by the head of the MHRA as the basis on which those decisions were made. Whether fully in, or in transition, we could have done the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 6:06 PM malc d - 2021-03-30 4:17 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 4:00 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-28 9:29 AM.............................The fact that you refuse to accept the evidence says more about you LOSERS than it does us WINNERS (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... What "evidence" FGS? Exactly what is it that "proves" the UK was right to leave the EU? In what way will the man on that famous Clapham omnibus be better off out, than he was in? It's obvious Brian. Because the UK has the National Health Service - and the EU hasn't ( because it's not a Nation ). If we had stayed in the EU - they ' prolly ' wouldn't allow us to use the NHS for pandemic purposes. :-| Its been said a number of times before Malc, but at the time the UK decisions on UK vaccine supply and approval were being made we were still in the transition period, and so still subject to EU regulation. That has been confirmed by the head of the MHRA as the basis on which those decisions were made. Whether fully in, or in transition, we could have done the same. Subject but leaving >:-) ........ I wonder how many EU citizens are currently wishing they were Brits? ;-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 I'm still waiting for that "proof" you were claiming to have! Where is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 6:00 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-28 10:08 AM If you dont believe me ;-) .........Ask our neighbours >:-) ....... IRELAND It’s so frustrating being six miles from the UK border but not having the vaccine Ireland: Number jabbed 515,800; % of population 10.4% 1 Aaron Daly, 43, a photographer from Dun Laoghaire, said: ‘I blame the government for failing to put in place the necessary logistics for the rollout. ‘Our health service has again shown failings in communication and organisation.’ His wife is a full-time carer to their daughter who has special needs. Neither has been allocated a vaccination and he says: ‘It could be months before our daughter is vaccinated. ‘I have family in the North, so am very aware how much quicker the rollout has been there. ‘Family carers in Northern Ireland and the UK were prioritised, which makes so much sense.’ 2 Siobhan O’Hara, 51, a part-time carer from Manorhamilton, Co Leitrim, said: ‘I am very disappointed – both with the limited amount of vaccines and the speed of the rollout. ‘Initially, I blame the EU Commission. Like anyone purchasing a product, they should have had complete transparency and official confirmation of quantities and delivery date assurances from AstraZeneca.’ Her mother needs full-time care and has only recently had the jab. 3 Corrinna Maguire, 43, a general manager from Glenboy Co Leitrim, said: ‘Our government is to blame. It should have organised the purchase of the vaccine better. Also, Brussels seems to have let the whole of Europe down on not securing enough vaccines quick enough. ‘The rollout across the UK and Northern Ireland is excellent. Other countries should follow suit. It’s frustrating living six miles from the border and not being able to get the vaccine.’ For days, our doctor’s surgery has been flooded with desperate calls for the jab FRANCE Daily cases 41,869 Number jabbed 7.2m, % of population 10.6% 4 Marc Droguet says the jab rollout race is not a rugby match 5 Francoise Durand, a GP in the Morbihan department in Brittany, says: ‘I have people crying out for vaccines and been flooded with desperate calls. I’ve appealed to the Ministry but there has been insufficient communication. ‘Today, I have ten doses available but there are 100 or more people waiting.There is very little faith in the government. People point the finger at Macron and say he has admitted that he has failed them. It is intolerable in a country like ours which prides itself on the excellence of its health service.’ 6 Retired Breton farmer Franck Lelievre spoke to the MoS while waiting at a surgery for a jab. He said: ‘I’m worried because I have a heart condition and high blood pressure. If I get Covid, it’s probably curtains for me. ‘I’ve been asking for a jab for weeks. There just haven’t been any available. Hopefully this morning I’ll get one. ‘You English seem to be ahead of France. Maybe it’s something to do with Brexit.’ 7 Sylvie, a 49-year-old shop assistant, said: ‘It’s a national scandal. We’ve been living with this evil virus for a year. Finally they’ve developed an antidote but we can’t get it.’ 8 Marc Droguet, deputy mayor of Redon, a town of 11,000 inhabitants, said: ‘Yes, we are behind England but this is not a a rugby match. There are no winners and losers. In the EU, we must work together to solve this crisis together. That’s what Europe is about. Whereas the English see fit to go it alone, we prefer to work together. Together we stand. Divided we fall. I’m very envious of how things are a lot better handled in the UK SPAIN Daily cases: 7,586. Number jabbed 4.6m, % of population 9.8% 9 Carer Oscar Martinez praises UK politicians for our jab rollout. Halted use of AstraZeneca for eight days, resulting in a stockpile of 735,652 doses. Initially, one of 11 EU countries that refused to recommend AZ for the elderly. It’s estimated that only 50 per cent of those aged 80 and over have been vaccinated. 10 Retired shoe buyer Jesus Blesa, 66, who lives in the Costa Blanca town of Torrevieja has not yet been jabbed. ‘I don’t know when I’ll get mine. It just goes to show you how slow things are here,’ he said. ‘I know things are a lot better in England and I’m envious. ‘Spain is on the verge of a third wave which would be devastating if it means another summer without foreign tourists.’ 11 Aroa Silgado, 36, from San Sebastian, suffers from the autoimmune disease Myositis, which inflames and weakens muscle fibres. She said: ‘I’m in a high-risk group and coronavirus could be a death sentence for me but I’ve yet to receive my first jab and I have no idea how long I’ll have to wait. There seems to be very little co-ordination at European level.’ She says she wrote to the Spanish Prime Minister, saying it was a ‘disgrace’ that she is still waiting for a vaccine. She got a reply saying the health ministry was ‘following protocols based on age and occupation. I have a friend in England who says they’re prioritising people according to their needs. That should happen here.’ 12 Refuse collector Jose Francisco Martinez, 46, says: ‘My dad is 79 and my mum 73 and neither have been jabbed. I admire the way Britain is responding.’ 13 Photographer Joaquin Carreon, 61, from Torrevieja, says: “The vaccine problem here is definitely a European problem. You can understand why people in the UK are happy they voted for Brexit.’ 14 Oscar Martinez, 55, who cares full-time for his mum in Miranda de Ebro near Burgos, northern Spain, said: ‘British politicians have been more on the ball.’ With an Anglo-Saxon mindset, Britain is better organised ITALY Daily cases: 24,076. Number jabbed: 6.2m, % of population 10.2 15 Coffee bar owner Giovanni Facile, 72, is still awaiting his first jab. There was widespread anger last week when 29 million doses of the AstraZeneca jab destined for EU nations and poorer countries were found stockpiled in a warehouse near Rome. 16 Housewife Antonia Piredda, 49, is angry that her 91-year-old mother-in-law has not yet had the jab. She says: ‘My daughter and sister-in-law, who are young but work at schools, have been vaccinated. The rollout in Italy has been seriously disorganised. The authorities still don’t know what they are doing. The health system here has always been chaotic. They can’t decide who to vaccinate first. ‘If they continue at this pace, we will never get back to normal. The UK has done well, they have executed their vaccine rollout to perfection. It would have been better to keep the vaccines here and not export them to the UK.’ 17 Pizza restaurant owner Massimo Cappellacci says: ‘The vaccination campaign here is very behind and disorganised. It is classic Italy. ‘The main problem is supply. It’s not the fault of the region, it is the EU’s fault, as it was Brussels that organised it. ‘As our prime minister has said, if it is working, then great, otherwise Italy should go it alone.’ Gino Barrozzi, a 60-year-old sales agent, says: ‘My 87-year-old mother is just getting her jab this week. ‘It should have been done much earlier. The UK has been much faster. It would have been much faster and more intelligent of Italy to do it alone.’ 18 Giovanni Facile, 72, owner of a coffee bar is still awaiting a jab and says ‘it’s not going to be for a while’. He explains: ‘They are giving them to other groups, such as lawyers, ahead of older people. This is how things work in Italy.’ We’ve seen bickering and petty politicking BELGIUM Daily cases: 6,123. Number jabbed: 1.2M, % of population 9.9% 19 Jo Verstuyft, a pharmacist in Puurs, says: ‘The Pfizer plant is just here, but I had to have an AstraZeneca vaccination made in the UK.’ 20 Danielle Jacobs, retired, said: ‘It’s so frustrating that Belgium produces so many doses but we don’t have enough for the Belgian people.’ 21 Eric Lemestre, a civil servant, said:‘The bickering about AstraZeneca has been as much petty politics as science.’ Just too much talk– and too few jabs NETHERLANDS Daily cases: 7,562. Number jabbed 1.5m, % of population 8.7% 22 Costis Budolas, a restaurant owner in Leiden, says: ‘The EU is collapsing. You Brits did the right thing to leave. ‘Outside the EU, you can be faster. I used to live in London. I know that trade has been affected by Brexit but I think this won’t last for long and the UK will be happy to have left within a few months.’ 23 Ruud Mestrom, a bar and restaurant owner, said: ‘Whereas Israel’s vaccination programme worked round the clock, here it’s just from 9am to 5pm.’ 24 Cancer sufferer Eveline van Koetsveld van Ankeron, owner of an art supplies shop, says: ‘Why do I have to wait so long for a jab? Maybe at the end of May or June I’ll get one. People who need the vaccine the most, why are they not getting it?’ 25 Bennie, an olive oil store manager, said: ‘There’s too much talk and not enough jabbing going on. There is a lack of leadership.’ Brussels has been caught sleeping GERMANY Daily cases: 20.689. Number jabbed: 8.6M, % of population 10.3 26 Product manager Juliana Becker says Brussels was too hesitant 27 Jorg Wilkens, 60, a carpenter from Hanover who has heart problems, says: ‘Compared to England, things are going badly here. The EU have been asleep. Every country should have got their own vaccine. I have no idea when I will get my jab.’ 28 Dr Arnulf Sander, 68, a GP whose wife Christiane works in his office, says: ‘England is way ahead of us. ‘Last year we started to build big vaccination centres all over the country but they are more or less empty now because we don’t have enough vaccines.’ Even when Germany’s vaccine campaign is accelerated next month, he says his surgery will only get 20 jabs a week. ‘What we need is less bureaucracy and more flexibility.’ 29 Juliana Becker, 28, a product manager, said: ‘The EU has acted too hesitantly. It seems that Brussels started negotiations with manufacturers far too late. ‘I have friends in England who are looking forward to being vaccinated in the next couple of weeks. I don’t think we will we’ll be getting our jab any time soon.’ Yet our resident LOSERS still defend the EU 8-) .......... I've edited the above to highlight just how many of the EU's residents are actually quoted. This was (and is) not an opinion poll, it is reportage by a notoriously selective, UK, pro Brexit, "Red Top" newspaper, which I doubt (based on precedence) would have included comments (even if it looked for any!) that favoured the EU's performance with Covid and the vaccine. A few facts. The EU has a population of just over 445 million. The seven countries whose citizens were interviewed have a combined population of 290 million (65% of the EU total). So, the "Daily Mail 29" account for precisely 0.0000065% of the EU population. Some sample!! (lol) This is not to say that those 29 people do not have entirely justified complaints, nor that there are many, many, more, with similar complaints regarding the EU's performance with Covid and the vaccines. However, the distribution and administration of the vaccines within the individual states is not controlled by the EU, but by those individual states. The EU's (self-inflicted) problem is supply. The EU Commission, in seeking to prevent a vaccine bidding war among its member states, in which the wealthier states would inevitably win out against the poorer states, resulting in the necessity to close borders across the EU to prevent virus spreading from the weak to the strong, suggested that they should take responsibility for sourcing the vaccines. The further decision was the the European Medicines Agency would also conduct all necessary testing so that what was then supplied could be distributed across all the states on a per-capita basis. Those suggestions were then accepted by the 27 member states. So far, so equitable. Like the UK (at the time still in transition, and so still bound by EU regulations), any member state could have opted out of both the supply and the approval regimes, and elected to source, approve, and distribute vaccine for their own use within their own territory. None did. The outcome proved an almighty failure for both sourcing and approval of vaccine that has resulted in a chronic shortage of, and catastrophically late delivery of, vaccine. Cynically, the Commission would have done better to stand back, leave the states to fight it out among themselves, and then try to control the resulting chaos while learning from the process and later seeking an EU wide treaty agreement designed to deal effectively with the next pandemic. But, they did not. They aimed for the stars and tragically missed by a country mile! But, the Commission was not formed, and has not become equipped, to act as the EU's NHS. It's primary reason for being was, and remains, free trade among its member states in goods and services, at which it has proved successful. So, a bad decision, taken with good intent, that has backfired humiliatingly, has left the Commission diminished. There will be a lot of grumbling and recrimination, and doubtless some heads will roll, and the next time there is a major pandemic there will probably be EU wide public health crisis management, and vaccine development and distribution, programmes in lieu of spatchcocked seat of the pants responses. So, will the Covid vaccine debacle signal the collapse of the EU? I somehow doubt it. To leave on the basis of this one, admittedly catastrophic, failure, would be to throw out the baby with the bathwater. Will the EU repeat the same mistakes next time round? I expect not. Will the result be a little humbling of the Commission, with more powers transferred to the Council and the parliament? I'd guess, probably, yes. Will Ursula von der Leyen fall on her sword or be decapitated? Maybe. Who knows? But, back to the concept of evidence, do the opinions of a justifiably disgruntled 0.0000065% of the EU's population provide evidence of the imminent demise of the EU, or represent a post hoc justification for the UK's departure? Do they hell!! (lol) On that subject, I'm just about sufficiently arrogant to propose the opposite - that had we and the EU not wasted the past five years over Brexit and instead remained as members and avoided the repeated elections and resultant catastrophe of Johnson's government, we would have contributed to a much better organised response to the virus across the whole EU. Sorry its long, but you can't get quarts into pint pots, can you? :-S The Pelmet Plonker skewered........again!! (lol)(lol)(lol)(lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 6:15 PM I'm still waiting for that "proof" you were claiming to have! Where is it? Seeing as you are refusing to accept reality ;-) ......... I guess its your problem :D ........ Meanwhile.....I'll carry on enjoying living in Brexit Blighty B-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-03-30 6:29 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 6:15 PM I'm still waiting for that "proof" you were claiming to have! Where is it? Seeing as you are refusing to accept reality ;-) ......... I guess its your problem :D ........ Meanwhile.....I'll carry on enjoying living in Brexit Blighty B-) ........ I always accept reality, there is no alternative. The question was not as to what is real, it was as to what is advantageous. You claimed to have proof that the UK was right to leave the EU. I asked for that proof. All I get is waffle and evasion. So, you can produce no proof. Is that correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 7:26 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-30 6:29 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 6:15 PM I'm still waiting for that "proof" you were claiming to have! Where is it? Seeing as you are refusing to accept reality ;-) ......... I guess its your problem :D ........ Meanwhile.....I'll carry on enjoying living in Brexit Blighty B-) ........ I always accept reality, there is no alternative. The question was not as to what is real, it was as to what is advantageous. You claimed to have proof that the UK was right to leave the EU. I asked for that proof. All I get is waffle and evasion. So, you can produce no proof. Is that correct? He's run off after pulling his usual trick of making another nonsense thread to push these questions down the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 7:26 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-30 6:29 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 6:15 PM I'm still waiting for that "proof" you were claiming to have! Where is it? Seeing as you are refusing to accept reality ;-) ......... I guess its your problem :D ........ Meanwhile.....I'll carry on enjoying living in Brexit Blighty B-) ........ I always accept reality, there is no alternative. The question was not as to what is real, it was as to what is advantageous. You claimed to have proof that the UK was right to leave the EU. I asked for that proof. All I get is waffle and evasion. So, you can produce no proof. Is that correct? Really??? ;-) ........ It's funny how you can't accept that Boris is doing a much better job of managing the Pandemic than any other EU country? >:-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurtainRaiser Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-03-30 8:38 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 7:26 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-30 6:29 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 6:15 PM I'm still waiting for that "proof" you were claiming to have! Where is it? Seeing as you are refusing to accept reality ;-) ......... I guess its your problem :D ........ Meanwhile.....I'll carry on enjoying living in Brexit Blighty B-) ........ I always accept reality, there is no alternative. The question was not as to what is real, it was as to what is advantageous. You claimed to have proof that the UK was right to leave the EU. I asked for that proof. All I get is waffle and evasion. So, you can produce no proof. Is that correct? Really??? ;-) ........ It's funny how you can't accept that Boris is doing a much better job of managing the Pandemic than any other EU country? >:-) ........ I can point you in the direction of 127,000 bodies that prove otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 CurtainRaiser - 2021-03-30 10:07 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-30 8:38 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 7:26 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-30 6:29 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 6:15 PM I'm still waiting for that "proof" you were claiming to have! Where is it? Seeing as you are refusing to accept reality ;-) ......... I guess its your problem :D ........ Meanwhile.....I'll carry on enjoying living in Brexit Blighty B-) ........ I always accept reality, there is no alternative. The question was not as to what is real, it was as to what is advantageous. You claimed to have proof that the UK was right to leave the EU. I asked for that proof. All I get is waffle and evasion. So, you can produce no proof. Is that correct? Really??? ;-) ........ It's funny how you can't accept that Boris is doing a much better job of managing the Pandemic than any other EU country? >:-) ........ I can point you in the direction of 127,000 bodies that prove otherwise. Considering the EU is being hit by the 3rd wave with just 10% vacinated 8-) ........ I suspect you are counting the Pandemic scores on the doors early doors *-) .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 31, 2021 Share Posted March 31, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-03-30 8:38 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 7:26 PM pelmetman - 2021-03-30 6:29 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-03-30 6:15 PM I'm still waiting for that "proof" you were claiming to have! Where is it? Seeing as you are refusing to accept reality ;-) ......... I guess its your problem :D ........ Meanwhile.....I'll carry on enjoying living in Brexit Blighty B-) ........ I always accept reality, there is no alternative. The question was not as to what is real, it was as to what is advantageous. You claimed to have proof that the UK was right to leave the EU. I asked for that proof. All I get is waffle and evasion. So, you can produce no proof. Is that correct? Really??? ;-) ........ It's funny how you can't accept that Boris is doing a much better job of managing the Pandemic than any other EU country? >:-) ....... Really?? Three things to make your toes curl. 1 Have a look at John53's "Failures of State" string. 2 Read Friedland's linked review. 3 Note that the two authors of the book are both Times journalists (so on Murdoch's, not Guardian, payroll). If you're honest, you'll just have to change you mind on your "much better job of managing the Pandemic than any other EU country" claim. Oooh er, Missus! They's cummin for yer! (lol) (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 31, 2021 Author Share Posted March 31, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-03-31 12:42 PM 1 Have a look at John53's "Failures of State" string. 2 Read Friedland's linked review. 3 Note that the two authors of the book are both Times journalists (so on Murdoch's, not Guardian, payroll). Rupert Murdoch is probably another loonie leftie by Dave's standards (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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