When are you too old to motorhome

[Derek Uzzell]

16 hours ago, Hans said:

Mine was renewed from 7-4-2023 up to  7 4- 2033.Born 29-8 44. So all the above is at random. Keep alive and do not talk yourself to dead.

Hans

The UK's driving-licence regulations clearly differ significantly from those of your country (Belgium) and I will try to provide you with a simplified explanation of the UK rules.

A basic UK driving-licence covering 'cars' (vehicles weighing no more than 3500kg) lasts until a driver reaches age 70. At age 70 drivers must apply to renew their 'car' driving-licence and replacement licences then last for 3 years. I have had four licence renewals (at ages 70, 73, 76 and 79) and this will also be true for Mike (Mickydripin).

An application for renewal of an 'Age 70' UK 'car' driving-licence can made on-line or by post, and in both cases a driver must make a health-related declaration (postal application declaration shown here)

If a driver puts an X in any of boxes 1 to 21, the DVLA's medical section will almost certainly get involved and this may seriously delay (or prevent) licence renewal from taking place.

Holders of any UK driving-licence are legally obliged to inform the DVLA if they develop certain medical conditions (referred to as 'notifiable' conditions) and a driver's age does not remove that obligation . Guidance on this is provided here https://www.gov.uk/health-conditions-and-driving 

There is an A-Z listing of medical conditions on this link https://www.gov.uk/health-conditions-and-driving/find-condition-a-to-z and Dementia is one of the conditions that a driver MUST notify the DVLA about when it has been diagnosed.

Mike said in his initial posting that he had "onset dementia", so he is obliged to notify the DVLA of that diagnosis. It is one of the UK driving-licence-related regulations and it could easily affect any decision he makes about buying another campervan. There is nothing 'random' about this.

[weldted]

I cant remember when was the last time a 70 plus failed to stop and raced off down the road at 100 mph plus but I can remember reading about quite a few youngsters doing it.

[Maggieanne]

This topic has hit home for my husband and me. On Wednesday, he was given a diagnosis of early dementia (he has been frustrated with memory issues for a while now) and was basically told he should cease driving straight away. This came as a shock at the time but he is now grumbling that he is driving better than a lot of younger drivers and is taking even more care whilst driving than when he was younger - he is now 83. He much prefers to drive our small motorhome than our car as he has been used to driving transit vans for work for most of his life. However, having been advised to stop driving due to the early dementia, he has done exactly that (told to wait before notifying DVLA until received the letter from the doctor). I am now considering doing the driving of the motorhome even though I am not entirely comfortable (vertically challenged so not easy driving for me) but we love the motorhoming way of life and do not want to give it up just yet. He is still fit and able and, as someone else has mentioned, does not want to just sit at home looking for things to do. Difficult decisions to make and I suppose it all depends on individual circumstances 

[david lloyd]

13 minutes ago, Maggieanne said:

This topic has hit home for my husband and me. On Wednesday, he was given a diagnosis of early dementia (he has been frustrated with memory issues for a while now) and was basically told he should cease driving straight away. This came as a shock at the time but he is now grumbling that he is driving better than a lot of younger drivers and is taking even more care whilst driving than when he was younger - he is now 83. He much prefers to drive our small motorhome than our car as he has been used to driving transit vans for work for most of his life. However, having been advised to stop driving due to the early dementia, he has done exactly that (told to wait before notifying DVLA until received the letter from the doctor). I am now considering doing the driving of the motorhome even though I am not entirely comfortable (vertically challenged so not easy driving for me) but we love the motorhoming way of life and do not want to give it up just yet. He is still fit and able and, as someone else has mentioned, does not want to just sit at home looking for things to do. Difficult decisions to make and I suppose it all depends on individual circumstances 

That’s a brave decision maggieanne - one none of us would readily want to take but, as I said earlier, ultimately it is for your safety and that of others at the expense of losing some of your (husbands) freedom.

I do hope you will both continue to enjoy the motorhome for as long as possible and can only hope that when the time is right I have the same courage to do the right thing.

David

[Derek Uzzell]

23 minutes ago, Maggieanne said:

...I am now considering doing the driving of the motorhome even though I am not entirely comfortable (vertically challenged so not easy driving for me) but we love the motorhoming way of life and do not want to give it up just yet....

I'm very sorry to learn of your problems, Margaret.

I notice (from another posting of yours) that you own a 2006 Autocruise "Starspirit" motorhome.

To make driving more comfortable for you, if your motorhome's driver's seat has a swivel  fitted, removing the swivel mechanism might help (and - based on Starspirit photos - should not greatly affect living in the vehicle).

A lower 'seat box' is also marketed for your Peugeot Boxer-based model (example advert here)

https://www.marcleleisure.co.uk/sportscraft-lowered-seat-box-fiat-ducato-x233-p-boxer-c-relay-1996-2003.html

but whether that would be suitable/helpful would depend on what Autocruise installed beneath the driver's seat.

[Maggieanne]

On 4/21/2023 at 12:08 PM, Derek Uzzell said:

I'm very sorry to learn of your problems, Margaret.

I notice (from another posting of yours) that you own a 2006 Autocruise "Starspirit" motorhome.

To make driving more comfortable for you, if your motorhome's driver's seat has a swivel  fitted, removing the swivel mechanism might help (and - based on Starspirit photos - should not greatly affect living in the vehicle).

A lower 'seat box' is also marketed for your Peugeot Boxer-based model (example advert here)

https://www.marcleleisure.co.uk/sportscraft-lowered-seat-box-fiat-ducato-x233-p-boxer-c-relay-1996-2003.html

but whether that would be suitable/helpful would depend on what Autocruise installed beneath the driver's seat.

Thanks for your suggestions Derek, we have a Starfire and I have already made an attempt to address the problem by fixing a block to the seat box which allows me to rest my heel a bit higher when using the accelerator without impacting the use of the brake or clutch, and I put a pillow behind me to allow me to sit further forward on the seat. I also have a small box to rest my feet on in the passenger position  but obviously will not need this in future. We do use the driver’s seat when turned to the living area so the lower seat box may be of interest if I cannot get on with the block I have made. The last time I drove the van, I had terrible cramp in my leg and pain in my ankle, so I came up with the block idea after that, as I didn’t know when I might have to drive again, being the support driver most of the time. The next challenge is to sort out a navigation aid as my husband is hopeless with maps and even more hopeless with tech so I must navigate at the same time as driving whilst maintaining absolute concentration on the driving 😳😂🤣

[Derek Uzzell]

It is possible to get 'pedal extenders' to make driving more comfortable (and safer) for people of shorter stature or with mobility issues. GOOGLE on car pedal extenders short drivers uk for more information.

I've now shrunk to a height of 5' 5", but I wasn't much taller in 2005 when I drove a new left-hand-drive Hobby motorhome 500 miles back from Germany. The vehicle had a high seat base as standard and Hobby had fitted a swivel on top. The trip back to my UK home was 'challenging' to say the least and the swivel mechanism was removed the day I arrived. I had travelled solo and 'super light' to Germany, with just a few pages torn from a car atlas to provide directions. Got hopelessly lost around midnight near Swindon and navigated home using the stars and the motorway system. Bought a Garmin sat-nav soon after, which probably saved my marriage.

[Barry Lineker]

22 hours ago, malc d said:

It's not just about votes of the elderly - it's about records of accidents. It's reported that older drivers are no more likely to have an accident than young ones - in fact the highest accident rate is among the youngest drivers.

Raising the age at which you can START driving may well reduce accidents significantly - but that would lose the young vote.   🙂

I had the majority of my accidents in my mid to late 20's😶

When I drove a bus for a living😏

The only accident I've had in recent years is jack knifing the trailer reversing of a fuel pump at the Spanish border with France😮

But in my defence I had been driving nonstop for hours after the Spanish had decided to kick us out, and we were being told they were going to shut the borders because of COVID😷

[Hans]

Check Your eyes left and right that there are no holes in your MACULA. Have YOu understood This?

[Derek Uzzell]

It's to be hoped that every optometrist will check a person's eyes for macular degeneration, but - for people who wish to educate themselves and/or DIY test - this link may be useful.

https://www.nuffieldhealth.com/article/test-yourself-for-age-related-macular-degeneration

[Pete-B]

Don't give up driving your van, why should you if medically your'e OK and you think your safe, it's surely like all life, so easy to think I'm too old!!!! I would suggest you contact a local driving instructor to make a honest assessment and go from there.

I'm 86 in a few weeks and the old Dutch is 81 and both of us are really looking forward to all this seasons trips. Especially as I've now had TBTTC frame fitted to a little Fiat 500 which means we can get about a bit more when we' parked up  Mind you, we still like our hill walking and won't give that up. Our first trip is to Grassington in N Yorkshire (going home for me) and there's some really challenging climbs to make there so we're looking forward to that.

I think one of the main things in life, particularly at our age, is to. eat healthily and exercise everyday which we do. We have a good healthy breakfast after a half grapefruit the only eat fruit during the day usually an apple orange and banana for lunch then a good home cooked meal in the evening. We also both exercise each day the good lady goes off for a long walk and I pound the tread mill for up to an hour and that's 7 days a week. I can fully appreciate that all of us can't do this but it is so easy to say "I'm getting on a bit and can't do these things anymore".

Anyhow my good friend get in that van and show your good lady you ain't finished yet but don't tell her I told you!!!!!

 

[Derek Uzzell]

1 hour ago, Pete-B said:

Don't give up driving your van, why should you if medically your'e OK and you think your safe....

Mike stated in his original posting that he is suffering from onset dementia, so he is clearly not medically OK. 

(Also, Mike does not own a motorhome - it's his wish to buy one that he was asking about.)

[Pete-B]

Appreciate that he mentioned he has onset Dementia but he also thinks he's still capable to drive and if is doctor agrees then he should. A close and very good friend of mine was in a similar situation and with his doctors approval went on to drive for a further 2 years before he gave up. 

Dementia effects people in different ways some people have onset and don't even know it and carry on as normal for some time. I think if your'e honest with yourself you'll know when the time comes to give up.

[John52]

17 minutes ago, Pete-B said:

Dementia effects people in different ways some people have onset and don't even know it and carry on as normal for some time. I think if your'e honest with yourself you'll know when the time comes to give up.

If they don't know they have got Dementia, how will they know its time to give up?

[Pete-B]

8 minutes ago, John52 said:

If they don't know they have got Dementia, how will they know its time to give up?

In my mates case, it initially started by him forgetting where he'd put something or going upstairs and then thinking, what did I come up here for. He did the sensible thing and checked this out with his doctor who said, "nothing to worry about it's a down to growing older thing". It wasn't until one day he was driving along and realised he was on the wrong road. He told me he was convinced he had to pick up something from his sons house but then realised that should have been the following day.

Luckily his wife could drive the van so they were able to carry on for sometime and he was convinced that by doing so it extended (normal life).

I pleased to say he's still with us and although the van is now gone he  gets out and potters in the garden and I pop round when I can with a couple of cans which he appreciates.It's very sad to see someone with this problem but he's convinced it's down to his fortitude and refusal to give him that's allowed him to carry for such a long time.

[david lloyd]

2 hours ago, Pete-B said:

Appreciate that he mentioned he has onset Dementia but he also thinks he's still capable to drive and if is doctor agrees then he should. A close and very good friend of mine was in a similar situation and with his doctors approval went on to drive for a further 2 years before he gave up. 

Dementia effects people in different ways some people have onset and don't even know it and carry on as normal for some time. I think if your'e honest with yourself you'll know when the time comes to give up.

Sorry Pete but the very nature of dementia means that the person with it, at some point, cannot recognise whether they are still capable to drive - many, as you say, do not even realise they have dementia.

Albeit a situation that can rob people of their independence (giving up driving that is) it is a serious safety issue that, as I say, the individual concerned may not recognise by the very nature of the illness. In my brothers case I found out after the accident he had that his family had been concerned at the standard of his driving and as was regularly in the wrong lane or even on the wrong side of the road at junctions that he knew well. When they delicately tried to point this out to him and reason that he maybe should cease driving he denied any issue and completely believed he was still a competent driver - after all, he had never had an accident in his life - until he did…..

Fortunately no one else was involved and he himself was not injured but, it could end up so much worse.

David

[colin]

On 4/21/2023 at 11:13 AM, weldted said:

I cant remember when was the last time a 70 plus failed to stop and raced off down the road at 100 mph plus but I can remember reading about quite a few youngsters doing it.

There have been several cases of elderly drivers somehow managing to drive the wrong way down motorways. 

M40 High Wycombe: Elderly driver drives down wrong way | Bucks Free Press

[onecal]

Hi

Just a question

Have you got someone that can drive you ?

Regards

[John52]

15 hours ago, Pete-B said:

In my mates case, it initially started by him forgetting where he'd put something or going upstairs and then thinking, what did I come up here for. He did the sensible thing and checked this out with his doctor who said, "nothing to worry about it's a down to growing older thing". It wasn't until one day he was driving along and realised he was on the wrong road. He told me he was convinced he had to pick up something from his sons house but then realised that should have been the following day.

Luckily his wife could drive the van so they were able to carry on for sometime and he was convinced that by doing so it extended (normal life).

I pleased to say he's still with us and although the van is now gone he  gets out and potters in the garden and I pop round when I can with a couple of cans which he appreciates.It'sy sad to see someone with this problem but he's convinced it's down to his fortitude and refusal to give him that's allowed him to carry for such a long time.

Some drivers know when its time to stop driving.

But some don't

Remember the Duke of Edinburgh?

Apparently he was the last person to realise when he should stop driving.

[weldted]

True about the elderly person, what about the American lady that drove on the wrong side of the road and killled a young man. With respect we can all find instances but whilst I agree some sort of checks etc would help prevent accidents but percentage wise its a minority.

but one is one too many.

[Derek Uzzell]

In the 1990s my late-uncle was in his early-80s, was living alone and beginning to show signs of severe memory loss. He was still driving and, eventually, drove counter-clockwise round a busy- roundabout on a local dual carriageway leaving carnage in his wake but not hitting anybody. On arriving home the police were waiting for him as his car's registration-plate had been reported to them by multiple witnesses.

I received a phone-call from the lady who helped with my uncle's housework (and had been a passenger in the car when the incident occurred) saying "Derek, can you come, the police have been". My uncle had no recollection of the accident - though his passenger had - and was adamant that nothing had happened.

I got in touch with my uncle's solicitor and a meeting (solicitor, uncle and me) was arranged at my uncle's home two days later. By then, the solicitor had contacted the police who were reluctant to prosecute such an old person. The police said that, if my uncle surrendered his driving-licence and agreed never to drive again, they would take the matter no further. The solicitor advised my uncle to do this and he happily said he would.

I visited my uncle a few days later and found a very angry man waving a letter (from his solicitor) at me and demanding what this accident nonsense was about and he was certainly not going to stop driving. He had no recollection of the accident, nor of the police visiting him, nor of the meeting with his solicitor. There was no point arguing, so I said "Why do you care? Every time I visit you you go on and on about how unenjoyable and expensive driving is nowadays and that there's nowhere you want to go anyway - so why bother?" "OK, he replied, "I'll stop". Before I left I disabled his car. My uncle's health went downhill after that, but at least he never put other people at risk by continuing to drive.

Secondhand experience of people who have dementia is one thing - when it's family and personal it's heart-breaking.

[malc d]

All the accidents that are being quoted have been caused by people who, sadly, were medically unfit to drive.

I haven't seen any that were said to be caused solely because of the drivers age.

 

[laimeduck]

6 hours ago, malc d said:

All the accidents that are being quoted have been caused by people who, sadly, were medically unfit to drive.

I haven't seen any that were said to be caused solely because of the drivers age.

Exactly .... it's horses for courses

https://www.inyourarea.co.uk/news/folkestone-mum-inspired-by-101-year-old-pilot-completes-first-marathon/

One of the disadvantages of having a C1 licence when you are over 70 is the 3 yearly medical .... but perhaps its not a disadvantage as you get checked?

[david lloyd]

2 hours ago, malc d said:

All the accidents that are being quoted have been caused by people who, sadly, were medically unfit to drive.

I haven't seen any that were said to be caused solely because of the drivers age.

 

I quite agree - age in itself us no barrier to driving. Sadly, Micky has early onset dementia and that is the common factor in the incidents quoted - albeit in most instances it has not been recognised or accepted by the person involved. Unfortunately age is (usually) the link to dementia in its various forms so whereas increasing age does not necessarily mean an end to driving certain medical conditions, especially linked to age, do.

The other common factor in some of the incidents is that the person affected is not aware of their diminishing ability to drive safely due to the nature of the illness.

David

[Derek Uzzell]

The Alzheimer's Society provides helpful and detailed advice on the following webpage titled How to keep driving after a dementia diagnosis

https://www.alzheimers.org.uk/get-support/staying-independent/keep-driving-dementia-diagnosis

As is made plain, the first (and compulsory) step after a person has been diagnosed with dementia is to tell the DVLA straightaway.