laimeduck Posted August 27, 2023 Share Posted August 27, 2023 We are away in Europe from the end of August until early October, heading across to Slovenia, Croatia and back through the Dolomites and Black Forest. We will be placing our ordinary cars on SORN for September. I then wondered about the necessity for having Tax on the the motorhome while we were away? Does it need to be taxed when not being driven in the UK? Is there a requirement to have valid UK tax when in Europe? It will be insured and MOT'd. Would the insurance be invalidated? Is there some sort of reciprocal agreement, or is this simply a UK requirement when on UK roads? I'm sure someone will know and I anticipate that the answer will be "yes it needs to be taxed", but I can't see how it could possibly be detected as long as we taxed it before our return to the UK? I'm not intending to try it out, but it is an interesting poser? Jeremy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted August 27, 2023 Share Posted August 27, 2023 To not get a fine you would need to declare it SORNed, quite how this affects insurance I don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted August 27, 2023 Share Posted August 27, 2023 I agree with Colin re the rules on SORN and also the gov.uk states... https://www.gov.uk/taking-vehicles-out-of-uk/for-less-than-12-months Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted August 27, 2023 Share Posted August 27, 2023 I suspect Ts&Cs may vary, but my insurance specifically requires the 'van to be taxed as a condition of the insurance being valid. Patently, the non-taxed status can be determined easily if the vehicle isn't SORNed (unless the proposal was to SORN it as soon as one was out of the country). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocs Posted August 27, 2023 Share Posted August 27, 2023 Another little regulation to overcome would be "If you bring your vehicle back to the UK untaxed you cannot drive it back into the UK - it’ll have to be transported and a SORN (Statutory Off Road Notification) must be made straight away." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laimeduck Posted August 27, 2023 Author Share Posted August 27, 2023 My hypothetical hypothesis is to leave UK on 30th August, then while in France, SORN the vehicle. Then in mid October , while returning through France, re-tax the vehicle .... very easy to do online. So at all times when driving in the UK the vehicle would be taxed. Who in Europe would know it wasn't taxed during September? As I say, hypothetical, but I can't see how anyone would know? (Unless maybe you had an accident?) Jeremy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevec176 Posted August 27, 2023 Share Posted August 27, 2023 According to www.gov.uk it states UK law still applies to a UK-registered vehicle if you take it abroad for less than 12 months. That means you need to make sure: your vehicle is taxed in the UK while it’s abroad you have a current MOT you have UK insurance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted August 28, 2023 Share Posted August 28, 2023 And for one month how much would you save? Not really worth the risk - accidents (even if not your fault) still happen in France and that would quickly highlight the issue for an insurer. Just enjoy your trip. David 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laimeduck Posted August 28, 2023 Author Share Posted August 28, 2023 I have no intention of doing it - it just struck me that it was possible. I simply don't see how anyone on the continent would know it wasn't taxed? Jeremy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted August 28, 2023 Share Posted August 28, 2023 1 hour ago, laimeduck said: I have no intention of doing it - it just struck me that it was possible. I simply don't see how anyone on the continent would know it wasn't taxed? Jeremy Neither do I But the DVLA would know if you get picked up on an ANPR camera (speeding, parking, infringing an emissions zone or whatever) and the foreign country requests your address to send the fine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laimeduck Posted August 28, 2023 Author Share Posted August 28, 2023 7 hours ago, John52 said: Neither do I But the DVLA would know if you get picked up on an ANPR camera (speeding, parking, infringing an emissions zone or whatever) and the foreign country requests your address to send the fine? John.....Wot? Me break the law? Never! Tee Hee! Good point though! Jeremy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRIGGER Posted August 28, 2023 Share Posted August 28, 2023 Your vehicle MUST be road legal in the UK to use it across the Channel, ie Taxed MOT and Insurance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cattwg Posted August 28, 2023 Share Posted August 28, 2023 When in France earlier this year I successfully taxed our motorhome by phone. You need the V5 number. https://www.gov.uk/tax-vehicle-without-v11-reminder Cattwg 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted August 28, 2023 Share Posted August 28, 2023 Under the Vienna Convention on International Traffic, to which HMG is a signatory, a vehicle is only legal on roads outside its state of registration if maintained legal within its state of registration. As having extant VED is a legal requirement for the vehicle to be driven on UK roads, it would be illegal under the Convention if driven outside the UK while untaxed. Now someone will pop up and say, "but how could they possibly tell?" That, I don't know, but now we're back to Dirty Harry - are you feeling lucky? 🙂 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted August 28, 2023 Share Posted August 28, 2023 Brian, I don’t know how ‘ lucky’ anyone may feel but having spent £00000’ on a motorhome I just can’t believe anyone would want to go to such lengths to save perhaps £20+ on a trip to France. As a Yorkshireman I'm all for finding economic ways to live but saving £20+ on a six week holiday is beyond my comprehension. David 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laimeduck Posted August 28, 2023 Author Share Posted August 28, 2023 As stated.... This was hypothetical! I have no intention or wish to break the law. It's a shame that my hypothetical question has been misconstrued by some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted August 29, 2023 Share Posted August 29, 2023 I can understand people feeling aggrieved about paying UK road tax when they are not using UK roads. I don't know if the situation is still the same, but when I drove lorries abroad this was a serious disadvantage for UK hauliers, and the reason so much traffic went to EU registered vehicles, UK charged much higher road tax than the EU. Which put the UK haulier at serious disadvantage, Furthermore we had to pay English bridge tolls, parking fees on motorway service areas etc etc. Wheras our foreign competitors could just stick 2 fingers up to them because they wouldn't be chased back to their base country to pay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted August 31, 2023 Share Posted August 31, 2023 On 28/08/2023 at 22:43, laimeduck said: As stated.... This was hypothetical! I have no intention or wish to break the law. It's a shame that my hypothetical question has been misconstrued by some. That's a wee bit rich, Jeremy. You asked a question to which I gave, to the best of my knowledge a factual answer. I made no assumptions as to intent, just explained what I believe are the rules, and where the come from. Or am I being over-sensitive about "misconstrued by some"? 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laimeduck Posted August 31, 2023 Author Share Posted August 31, 2023 1 hour ago, Brian Kirby said: That's a wee bit rich, Jeremy. You asked a question to which I gave, to the best of my knowledge a factual answer. I made no assumptions as to intent, just explained what I believe are the rules, and where the come from. Or am I being over-sensitive about "misconstrued by some"? 🙂 Not directed at you Brian ... as usual you give the facts. I probably worded my original query ambiguously which caused some confusion. I think I clarified what I meant later ie SORN In France after leaving UK. I was simply intrigued to see if I had found a loophole in the system .... I think I have, but you need to break the law to do it which I would not do. I think some thought I would? Jeremy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted August 31, 2023 Share Posted August 31, 2023 Thank you Jeremy. All understood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted September 2, 2023 Share Posted September 2, 2023 On 31/08/2023 at 17:16, laimeduck said: Not directed at you Brian ... as usual you give the facts. I probably worded my original query ambiguously which caused some confusion. I think I clarified what I meant later ie SORN In France after leaving UK. I was simply intrigued to see if I had found a loophole in the system .... I think I have, but you need to break the law to do it which I would not do. I think some thought I would? Jeremy Sorry if it was my post that may have offended Jeremy - certainly no offence intended - just my own opinion that whatever the rights and wrongs it would seem like a lot of work for a small return. David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laimeduck Posted September 2, 2023 Author Share Posted September 2, 2023 2 minutes ago, david lloyd said: Sorry if it was my post that may have offended Jeremy - certainly no offence intended - just my own opinion that whatever the rights and wrongs it would seem like a lot of work for a small return. David David no. No offense .... misconstrued does not imply that. I simply think I confused a few who didn't understand what I was getting at. Probably my fault. Jeremy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted September 3, 2023 Share Posted September 3, 2023 S'alright, Jeremy. We won't dob you in. 😉 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laimeduck Posted September 3, 2023 Author Share Posted September 3, 2023 Too late now Robin ... I'm on Wolfgangsee waiting to climb Schaffburg* No DVLA spies here? *.... first time since 1969. (But this time I'm taking the train!) Jeremy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted September 3, 2023 Share Posted September 3, 2023 12 minutes ago, laimeduck said: I'm on Wolfgangsee waiting to climb Schaffburg* No DVLA spies here? Jeremy They know where to find you now, though...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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