antony1969 Posted April 1, 2018 Author Share Posted April 1, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-01 7:25 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-31 7:26 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-03-31 5:49 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-31 4:00 PM...................................... 2 ... But Brian I might say about you from your posts your a boring , wet politically correct fart might I because that might be the opinion I get from your posts ... It doesn't mean it's true and I would fully expect you to challenge me for proof of such if I called you that 3 ... I'm glad to say I disagree ... People are quite rightly angered by Labour's anti-Semitic views because Jewish people on the whole in this country are all decent people and certainly don't deserve our opposition party making light of the holocaust and other disgusting remarks 2 Indeed you might Antony, but if you'd drawn that conclusion from my posts, and I then asked me to prove it, my guess is that you'd say "just read your own posts, you're condemned by your own writing". 3 I don't think I said otherwise, did I? But, holocaust denial doesn't seem to me anti Semitic. The holocaust itself was of course a grotesque act of anti-Semitism, but I don't see how denying that it happened is. It denies that a well documented historic event took place, but that is not, in and of itself, proof that the denier is a hater of Jews. It is merely proof that the person doesn't want, for whatever reason, to admit to themselves that such an event took place. That may well rule them out of many public offices, but on political grounds rather than for being an anti-Semite. Holocaust denial is anti history, yes, but if someone were to deny that the Norman invasion took place, and that thousands of Saxons were killed during their invasion, it wouldn't make that person Francophobic, would it? It would certainly make them odd, eccentric, even ignorant and unpleasant but, in my opinion, no worse. 2 ... Your guess would be wrong ... If I was asked to prove it and couldn't then it would be obvious to all the forum who the tool was ... Me 3 ... Sorry Brian ... I don't believe denying the holocaust could happen for any other reason than the denier being anti-Semitic ... Could you give any other explanation to deny a well documented fact like the holocaust 2 So, how would you prove I am "a boring , wet politically correct fart" if that were the opinion you get from my posts? The best proof you could present would be no more than opinion, wouldn't it? But, opinion is not proof: proof requires factual evidence and, in the matter of whether someone is boring, wet, politically correct, or a fart, factual evidence is unlikely to be found, because those things are but one person's opinion of another. That is why I said your frequent requests for proof are fatuous: no proof is possible. 3 But that is belief, and you might just hold that belief because you haven't yet given the possibility sufficient consideration. It wasn't the Jews who conducted the holocaust, they were the victims. So, anyone who was deeply horrified and ashamed that one group of people, especially their own people, could treat another group in that way, in the 20th century, in Christian northern Europe, might refuse to believe such a thing could ever have happened. That reaction might be more prevalent in Germany, in parts of eastern France, in Austria, and especially Poland. After all, the camps weren't located in Germany but in Poland, at Chelmno, Belzec, Sobibór, Treblinka, Auschwitz, Majdanek, Trostenets, in Croatia, near Gospic and Jasenovac. There must be thousands of people who have reason to deny that such events took place in the areas where they live. I find that understandable. Being so deeply ashamed and humiliated by what your fellow countrymen, or even neighbours, did during the war, that one refuses to believe it possible, seems entirely understandable to me. Now, I am not suggesting that no holocaust deniers are anti-Semites (I am happy to accept that the majority of today's deniers probably are - some notoriously so): that would be foolish. But, by the same token, it is equally foolish to argue that all holocaust deniers must be anti-Semites merely on the ground that others are. 1 ... Exactly I have asked for evidence against me and guess what not a dot !!! 2 ... So if it's foolish to suggest in your words that "all holocaust deniers must be anti-Semites then the same might be said for me who merely questions Islam , that I'm not racist or an Islamaphobe after all I am only questioning Islamic teaching not denying one of the biggest mass murders in history Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted April 1, 2018 Share Posted April 1, 2018 Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 7:10 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:35 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 6:13 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:00 PM I presume you can link to the Yougov poll rather than your homemade jpeg? ;-) ....... Just askin for clarification? :D ........... Fill yer boots. https://antisemitism.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Antisemitism-Barometer-2017.pdf I just did ;-) Are you still using Windows 3 on dial up......because your search 'ability' seems badly lacking limited to Daily Heil or Twitter. Here......and look for the obvious yourself. I've done enough wet nursing for you today. *-) https://antisemitism.uk/barometer/ Did Corbyn write it? :D ....... The co-founder of YouGov is a Muslim Tory MP. Black Rock is one of it's major shareholders.......same company who pay George Osborne £650k pa for doing errr.....not very much. I've searched the Yougov website ;-) ........ Coz as I said earlier I'm a member and "I can't find any such poll" :D ........ Just sayin AGAIN *-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted April 1, 2018 Share Posted April 1, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-04-01 7:56 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 7:10 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:35 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 6:13 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:00 PM I presume you can link to the Yougov poll rather than your homemade jpeg? ;-) ....... Just askin for clarification? :D ........... Fill yer boots. https://antisemitism.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Antisemitism-Barometer-2017.pdf I just did ;-) Are you still using Windows 3 on dial up......because your search 'ability' seems badly lacking limited to Daily Heil or Twitter. Here......and look for the obvious yourself. I've done enough wet nursing for you today. *-) https://antisemitism.uk/barometer/ Did Corbyn write it? :D ....... The co-founder of YouGov is a Muslim Tory MP. Black Rock is one of it's major shareholders.......same company who pay George Osborne £650k pa for doing errr.....not very much. I've searched the Yougov website ;-) ........ Coz as I said earlier I'm a member and "I can't find any such poll" :D ........ Just sayin AGAIN *-) ......... You don't have to be "a member" to access YouGov. What is the matter with you?? *-) The reason you "can't find any poll" is because you've not bothered to look at that second link properly. READ IT fgs!! *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted April 1, 2018 Share Posted April 1, 2018 Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 8:32 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 7:56 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 7:10 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:35 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 6:13 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:00 PM I presume you can link to the Yougov poll rather than your homemade jpeg? ;-) ....... Just askin for clarification? :D ........... Fill yer boots. https://antisemitism.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Antisemitism-Barometer-2017.pdf I just did ;-) Are you still using Windows 3 on dial up......because your search 'ability' seems badly lacking limited to Daily Heil or Twitter. Here......and look for the obvious yourself. I've done enough wet nursing for you today. *-) https://antisemitism.uk/barometer/ Did Corbyn write it? :D ....... The co-founder of YouGov is a Muslim Tory MP. Black Rock is one of it's major shareholders.......same company who pay George Osborne £650k pa for doing errr.....not very much. I've searched the Yougov website ;-) ........ Coz as I said earlier I'm a member and "I can't find any such poll" :D ........ Just sayin AGAIN *-) ......... You don't have to be "a member" to access YouGov. What is the matter with you?? *-) The reason you "can't find any poll" is because you've not bothered to look at that second link properly. READ IT fgs!! *-) You mean this link ;-) ......... https://antisemitism.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Antisemitism-Barometer-2017.pdf Which show's a poll carried out by Yougov :-| .......... A POLL THAT YOUGOV DOESN'T APPARENTLY HAVE ANY RECORD OF???? ;-) ......... Has that sunk in yet Bullet??? *-) ........ So frankly you're just peddling fake news, unless you can find it on the Yougov website? >:-) ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted April 1, 2018 Author Share Posted April 1, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-04-01 8:43 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 8:32 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 7:56 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 7:10 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:35 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 6:13 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:00 PM I presume you can link to the Yougov poll rather than your homemade jpeg? ;-) ....... Just askin for clarification? :D ........... Fill yer boots. https://antisemitism.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Antisemitism-Barometer-2017.pdf I just did ;-) Are you still using Windows 3 on dial up......because your search 'ability' seems badly lacking limited to Daily Heil or Twitter. Here......and look for the obvious yourself. I've done enough wet nursing for you today. *-) https://antisemitism.uk/barometer/ Did Corbyn write it? :D ....... The co-founder of YouGov is a Muslim Tory MP. Black Rock is one of it's major shareholders.......same company who pay George Osborne £650k pa for doing errr.....not very much. I've searched the Yougov website ;-) ........ Coz as I said earlier I'm a member and "I can't find any such poll" :D ........ Just sayin AGAIN *-) ......... You don't have to be "a member" to access YouGov. What is the matter with you?? *-) The reason you "can't find any poll" is because you've not bothered to look at that second link properly. READ IT fgs!! *-) You mean this link ;-) ......... https://antisemitism.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Antisemitism-Barometer-2017.pdf Which show's a poll carried out by Yougov :-| .......... A POLL THAT YOUGOV DOESN'T APPARENTLY HAVE ANY RECORD OF???? ;-) ......... Has that sunk in yet Bullet??? *-) ........ So frankly you're just peddling fake news, unless you can find it on the Yougov website? >:-) ........... Chuckle ... Snort ... Funneee ... Trump ... Brexit ... Barry ... Boy friend ... Groomed ... Hermit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted April 1, 2018 Share Posted April 1, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-01 7:25 PM There must be thousands of people who have reason to deny that such events took place in the areas where they live. I find that understandable. Being so deeply ashamed and humiliated by what your fellow countrymen, or even neighbours, did during the war, that one refuses to believe it possible, seems entirely understandable to me. Jan Karski's account makes interesting reading. Karski worked with the Polish Resistance during the war and risked his life to get smuggled into Treblinka and the Warsaw ghetto as he couldn't believe what he was hearing.....so got a first hand eye witness experience. Determined to alert the allies he risked his life yet again by travelling through Europe until he reached UK where he met with Anthony Eden, then Foreign minister. But Eden showed little interest and Churchill was "too busy" to see him. He then went to the US where he met Roosevelt who in Karski's words was "rather noncommittal". Roosevelt seemed to view the suffering of the Jews as just another unfortunate aspect of what civilians suffer in every war. He did not believe it was justified for the US to use its resources to rescue Jews from the Nazis. And he did not want hundreds of thousands of Jewish refugees on his hands, clamouring to be admitted to the United States. Karski wasn't even Jewish! He was a Polish Roman Catholic yet did more to try and alert the world to what was going on than anyone else and his accounts are well documented. http://foreignpolicy.com/2014/04/24/how-a-polish-courier-tried-to-tell-the-world-about-the-holocaust/ http://holocaustonline.org/significant-events/jan-karski-meets-british-and-us-leaders/ In a pdf here; When the World Stood Aside – The Allied Reaction to Jan Karski’s Report from Hell https://academicworks.cuny.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1012&context=qb_pubs Another good read, though pretty chilling and damning; https://www.amazon.co.uk/While-Six-Million-Died-1998-02-01/dp/B01FIZVGAE/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1522612993&sr=8-2&keywords=arthur+d+morse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted April 1, 2018 Share Posted April 1, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-04-01 8:43 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 8:32 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 7:56 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 7:10 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:35 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 6:13 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:00 PM I presume you can link to the Yougov poll rather than your homemade jpeg? ;-) ....... Just askin for clarification? :D ........... Fill yer boots. https://antisemitism.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Antisemitism-Barometer-2017.pdf I just did ;-) Are you still using Windows 3 on dial up......because your search 'ability' seems badly lacking limited to Daily Heil or Twitter. Here......and look for the obvious yourself. I've done enough wet nursing for you today. *-) https://antisemitism.uk/barometer/ Did Corbyn write it? :D ....... The co-founder of YouGov is a Muslim Tory MP. Black Rock is one of it's major shareholders.......same company who pay George Osborne £650k pa for doing errr.....not very much. I've searched the Yougov website ;-) ........ Coz as I said earlier I'm a member and "I can't find any such poll" :D ........ Just sayin AGAIN *-) ......... You don't have to be "a member" to access YouGov. What is the matter with you?? *-) The reason you "can't find any poll" is because you've not bothered to look at that second link properly. READ IT fgs!! *-) You mean this link ;-) ......... https://antisemitism.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Antisemitism-Barometer-2017.pdf Which show's a poll carried out by Yougov :-| .......... A POLL THAT YOUGOV DOESN'T APPARENTLY HAVE ANY RECORD OF???? ;-) ......... Oh for Gods sake Pelmethead........READ!!! Here........AGAIN......and this is the last time i'm posting it because quite frankly it would be easier to teach a child ABC. *-) https://antisemitism.uk/barometer/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 Reluctant as I am to reveal my true role I feel it is time that I do in light of the recent exposé in the Sunday Times regarding Jeremy Corbyn’s “ hate factory”. I work for Theresa May in her PR department. I have been tasked with responding to posts from Antony and Dave so as to counter any suggestion there might be that she supports anything they say, particularly on their pet subject. It’s tedious work but someone’s got to do it. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted April 2, 2018 Author Share Posted April 2, 2018 It's amazing that those on here who preach to the supposed haters about tolerance seem to hate the fact hate and much of it has been exposed in their party ... Strange one you'd think they'd be glad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-04-02 10:36 AM It's amazing that those on here who preach to the supposed haters about tolerance seem to hate the fact hate and much of it has been exposed in their party ... Strange one you'd think they'd be glad I’m not a member of any political party Antony nor am I doubting that there are anti-Semites in the Labour party who need to be dealt with e.g. Ken Livingstone should have been banned for life in my view for his continued disingenuous defence of his remarks about Zionists and Hitler. My jest was at the equally disingenuous headline “Corbyn’s hate factory” in yesterday’s Sunday Times. How Jezza can be held responsible for anti-Semitic remarks made by vile people on the facebook pages of Labour sub-groups is beyond me. It’s facebook that should be in the frame for that, not people who have no control over such posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted April 2, 2018 Author Share Posted April 2, 2018 Violet1956 - 2018-04-02 11:05 AM antony1969 - 2018-04-02 10:36 AM It's amazing that those on here who preach to the supposed haters about tolerance seem to hate the fact hate and much of it has been exposed in their party ... Strange one you'd think they'd be glad I’m not a member of any political party Antony nor am I doubting that there are anti-Semites in the Labour party who need to be dealt with e.g. Ken Livingstone should have been banned for life in my view for his continued disingenuous defence of his remarks about Zionists and Hitler. My jest was at the equally disingenuous headline “Corbyn’s hate factory” in yesterday’s Sunday Times. How Jezza can be held responsible for anti-Semitic remarks made by vile people on the facebook pages of Labour sub-groups is beyond me. It’s facebook that should be in the frame for that, not people who have no control over such posts. Not a member of any party either Veronica but I know who my party is as you know yours ... You can bet UKIP or those nasty Tories would have been responsible had it been Facebook groups supporting them though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-04-02 11:24 AM Violet1956 - 2018-04-02 11:05 AM antony1969 - 2018-04-02 10:36 AM It's amazing that those on here who preach to the supposed haters about tolerance seem to hate the fact hate and much of it has been exposed in their party ... Strange one you'd think they'd be glad I’m not a member of any political party Antony nor am I doubting that there are anti-Semites in the Labour party who need to be dealt with e.g. Ken Livingstone should have been banned for life in my view for his continued disingenuous defence of his remarks about Zionists and Hitler. My jest was at the equally disingenuous headline “Corbyn’s hate factory” in yesterday’s Sunday Times. How Jezza can be held responsible for anti-Semitic remarks made by vile people on the facebook pages of Labour sub-groups is beyond me. It’s facebook that should be in the frame for that, not people who have no control over such posts. Not a member of any party either Veronica but I know who my party is as you know yours ... You can bet UKIP or those nasty Tories would have been responsible had it been Facebook groups supporting them though Two wrongs don't make a right though do they Antony? I think I've made clear my own view about who should be held responsible for vile comments on social media. It is the people who post them and the people who have the power to remove them but don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-04-01 7:50 PM...................................... 1 ... Exactly I have asked for evidence against me and guess what not a dot !!! 2 ... So if it's foolish to suggest in your words that "all holocaust deniers must be anti-Semites then the same might be said for me who merely questions Islam , that I'm not racist or an Islamaphobe after all I am only questioning Islamic teaching not denying one of the biggest mass murders in history 1 So now you know why. There can be no proof, only opinion. An opinion you tend to generate by repeatedly picking criticising Muslims/Islam without discriminating between the good and the bad. I know I've said this before, but if you acknowledged that not all Muslims behave in ways we all find unacceptable, but a minority, you would dispel that impression in an instant. 2 But, Antony, I haven't seen you questioning the teaching of Islam, or Islam itself. What you question, if that is the right word, is the behaviour of some Muslims, which you by default attribute to all Muslims by referring only to "Muslims" in general, or "Islam" in general. If you wanted to discuss aspects of Islam, or the teaching of Islam, you could, but I don't think I've ever seen a post of yours that is that specific. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted April 2, 2018 Author Share Posted April 2, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-02 1:19 PM antony1969 - 2018-04-01 7:50 PM...................................... 1 ... Exactly I have asked for evidence against me and guess what not a dot !!! 2 ... So if it's foolish to suggest in your words that "all holocaust deniers must be anti-Semites then the same might be said for me who merely questions Islam , that I'm not racist or an Islamaphobe after all I am only questioning Islamic teaching not denying one of the biggest mass murders in history 1 So now you know why. There can be no proof, only opinion. An opinion you tend to generate by repeatedly picking criticising Muslims/Islam without discriminating between the good and the bad. I know I've said this before, but if you acknowledged that not all Muslims behave in ways we all find unacceptable, but a minority, you would dispel that impression in an instant. 2 But, Antony, I haven't seen you questioning the teaching of Islam, or Islam itself. What you question, if that is the right word, is the behaviour of some Muslims, which you by default attribute to all Muslims by referring only to "Muslims" in general, or "Islam" in general. If you wanted to discuss aspects of Islam, or the teaching of Islam, you could, but I don't think I've ever seen a post of yours that is that specific. 1 ... We seem to be going around in circles ... You ask me to say some Muslims but you don't ask others to say some when they talk about Brexit voters , Tories , Yanks but I'm expected to do so because the other day you claimed it would make me better than them ??? 2 ... Brian most wrongs done by Muslims can be traced back to their religion ... Terrorism , FGM , homophobia , hatred of Jews and so on and so on ... Just because you can't accept that doesn't mean I'm wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 9:13 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 8:43 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 8:32 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 7:56 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 7:10 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:35 PM Bulletguy - 2018-04-01 6:13 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-01 6:00 PM I presume you can link to the Yougov poll rather than your homemade jpeg? ;-) ....... Just askin for clarification? :D ........... Fill yer boots. https://antisemitism.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Antisemitism-Barometer-2017.pdf I just did ;-) Are you still using Windows 3 on dial up......because your search 'ability' seems badly lacking limited to Daily Heil or Twitter. Here......and look for the obvious yourself. I've done enough wet nursing for you today. *-) https://antisemitism.uk/barometer/ Did Corbyn write it? :D ....... The co-founder of YouGov is a Muslim Tory MP. Black Rock is one of it's major shareholders.......same company who pay George Osborne £650k pa for doing errr.....not very much. I've searched the Yougov website ;-) ........ Coz as I said earlier I'm a member and "I can't find any such poll" :D ........ Just sayin AGAIN *-) ......... You don't have to be "a member" to access YouGov. What is the matter with you?? *-) The reason you "can't find any poll" is because you've not bothered to look at that second link properly. READ IT fgs!! *-) You mean this link ;-) ......... https://antisemitism.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Antisemitism-Barometer-2017.pdf Which show's a poll carried out by Yougov :-| .......... A POLL THAT YOUGOV DOESN'T APPARENTLY HAVE ANY RECORD OF???? ;-) ......... Oh for Gods sake Pelmethead........READ!!! Here........AGAIN......and this is the last time i'm posting it because quite frankly it would be easier to teach a child ABC. *-) https://antisemitism.uk/barometer/ So DUM DUM why does this so called poll not appear on the Yougov website seeing as they've supposedly carried it out? ;-) .......... Just askin Yet again? *-) ........ BTW here's the link :D ......... https://yougov.co.uk See if you can find it? :-S ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 Violet1956 - 2018-04-02 8:42 AM Reluctant as I am to reveal my true role I feel it is time that I do in light of the recent exposé in the Sunday Times regarding Jeremy Corbyn’s “ hate factory”. I work for Theresa May in her PR department. I have been tasked with responding to posts from Antony and Dave so as to counter any suggestion there might be that she supports anything they say, particularly on their pet subject. It’s tedious work but someone’s got to do it. ;-) You do know you wont go to heaven if you tell fibs? 8-) .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-04-02 3:04 PM Violet1956 - 2018-04-02 8:42 AM Reluctant as I am to reveal my true role I feel it is time that I do in light of the recent exposé in the Sunday Times regarding Jeremy Corbyn’s “ hate factory”. I work for Theresa May in her PR department. I have been tasked with responding to posts from Antony and Dave so as to counter any suggestion there might be that she supports anything they say, particularly on their pet subject. It’s tedious work but someone’s got to do it. ;-) You do know you wont go to heaven if you tell fibs? 8-) .......... Yep. One day you and I will meet in hell Dave but it's the journey that counts right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 I don't trust any of 'em but on balance I think that Theresa's fibs are much less unacceptable than Jeremy's porkies! Have a good journey and I'll see you both when we get there - if we get there as I doubt that it exists and when yer ded, yer ded - end of! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 Tracker - 2018-04-02 5:17 PM I don't trust any of 'em but on balance I think that Theresa's fibs are much less unacceptable to Jeremy's porkies! Hi Rich daughter is back home safe and sound. Phew! Just need the OH to check out the flooding issue and then she's planning to go off again in it in July. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 Violet1956 - 2018-04-02 5:19 PM Hi Rich daughter is back home safe and sound. Phew! Just need the OH to check out the flooding issue and then she's planning to go off again in it in July. Thanks Veronica, glad all's well that ends well - at least untill the next time! You are braver than me allowing any offspring loose on your pride and joy!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-04-02 1:42 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-04-02 1:19 PM antony1969 - 2018-04-01 7:50 PM...................................... 1 ... Exactly I have asked for evidence against me and guess what not a dot !!! 2 ... So if it's foolish to suggest in your words that "all holocaust deniers must be anti-Semites then the same might be said for me who merely questions Islam , that I'm not racist or an Islamaphobe after all I am only questioning Islamic teaching not denying one of the biggest mass murders in history 1 So now you know why. There can be no proof, only opinion. An opinion you tend to generate by repeatedly picking criticising Muslims/Islam without discriminating between the good and the bad. I know I've said this before, but if you acknowledged that not all Muslims behave in ways we all find unacceptable, but a minority, you would dispel that impression in an instant. 2 But, Antony, I haven't seen you questioning the teaching of Islam, or Islam itself. What you question, if that is the right word, is the behaviour of some Muslims, which you by default attribute to all Muslims by referring only to "Muslims" in general, or "Islam" in general. If you wanted to discuss aspects of Islam, or the teaching of Islam, you could, but I don't think I've ever seen a post of yours that is that specific. 1 ... We seem to be going around in circles ... You ask me to say some Muslims but you don't ask others to say some when they talk about Brexit voters , Tories , Yanks but I'm expected to do so because the other day you claimed it would make me better than them ??? 2 ... Brian most wrongs done by Muslims can be traced back to their religion ... Terrorism , FGM , homophobia , hatred of Jews and so on and so on ... Just because you can't accept that doesn't mean I'm wrong 1 You're right, we are, so I'm going to "do an Antony", by way of explanation, :-) and ask you where I claimed it would make you "better than them" if you were more selective - because I don't think I actually said anything of the sort. So, where is it? But, beside that, what's your objection to being better than them? Do you want to be merely the same as "them", or worse? :-D 2 You over simplify. If I say you indiscriminately criticise "Muslims", I mean no more than that, as I think you well understand. So responding to the suggestion that you clarify what and who it is that you are, actually, criticising, by alleging that means I can't accept that Islam has some very strange and unacceptable teachings is indeed going in circles by - avoiding the point I made. You give the impression of being unable to see that there is something between total rejection, and complete acceptance. My point, as you must by now know, is that while some of Islam's teachings are totally unacceptable within any civilised society, not all its teachings are, just as the behaviour of some Muslims is totally unacceptable within a western democracy, but not all Muslims behave in that way. I am all too aware that we have a problem with elements among Muslim immigrants. That is self-evident. My contention is that implying we therefore have a problem with all Muslim immigrants gets us precisely nowhere, and doing so is futile and unhelpful. Seeking to defend that kind of indiscriminate demonising of Islam and its followers by reasoning that because some followers of the Koran are murderers and rapists, it follows that all its followers are a threat to our society, is little, if any, different to the demonising of the Jews to which you so strongly object. Surely you can see that? Sauce, goose, and gander? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-04-02 3:01 PM So DUM DUM why does this so called poll not appear on the Yougov website seeing as they've supposedly carried it out? ;-) .......... Just askin Yet again? *-) ........ Pelmethead........are you seriously so thick or simply being disingenuous or purposely obtuse? I'll make it simple for you but have no pretty pictures to help you. 1) The poll was conducted by YouGov in 2017.......it states that if you look at the chart. 2) It's on a pdf file titled "Campaign Against Antisemitism" which i posted yesterday at 6:03pm.....but you claim you couldn't access a pdf file (it's about time you learned how to). 3) At 7:10pm i posted you another link where you could access it https://antisemitism.uk/barometer/ I went on to post that link twice more yet you waffled on and on about 'not finding it on YouGov' after i'd told you twice it's the poll which was done by YouGov, not the website, and gave you another link where you could access it. Haven't you got Adobe installed? :-S It's totally free and takes seconds to install. https://get.adobe.com/uk/reader/ Here is another YouGov poll you won't like: The most recent YouGov poll, conducted one year from the date in 2019 when the UK officially leaves the European Union, shows that a majority of British people now regret voting for Brexit. http://uk.businessinsider.com/poll-majority-of-british-people-regret-voting-for-brexit-2018-4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-04-02 1:42 PM Brian most wrongs done by Muslims can be traced back to their religion ... FGM.... FGM is illegal in UK and rightly so but whilst on that subject it's worth including a practice not forbidden in UK.....circumcision at birth which imo is tantamount to the exactly the same as FGM. Some see it as child abuse and i tend to agree UK sanctions it on religious grounds but medically it’s only legal to resolve a medical problem if in the best interest of the child or adult. It’s seen as unethical and unnecessary by many doctors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted April 2, 2018 Author Share Posted April 2, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-02 5:31 PM antony1969 - 2018-04-02 1:42 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-04-02 1:19 PM antony1969 - 2018-04-01 7:50 PM...................................... 1 ... Exactly I have asked for evidence against me and guess what not a dot !!! 2 ... So if it's foolish to suggest in your words that "all holocaust deniers must be anti-Semites then the same might be said for me who merely questions Islam , that I'm not racist or an Islamaphobe after all I am only questioning Islamic teaching not denying one of the biggest mass murders in history 1 So now you know why. There can be no proof, only opinion. An opinion you tend to generate by repeatedly picking criticising Muslims/Islam without discriminating between the good and the bad. I know I've said this before, but if you acknowledged that not all Muslims behave in ways we all find unacceptable, but a minority, you would dispel that impression in an instant. 2 But, Antony, I haven't seen you questioning the teaching of Islam, or Islam itself. What you question, if that is the right word, is the behaviour of some Muslims, which you by default attribute to all Muslims by referring only to "Muslims" in general, or "Islam" in general. If you wanted to discuss aspects of Islam, or the teaching of Islam, you could, but I don't think I've ever seen a post of yours that is that specific. 1 ... We seem to be going around in circles ... You ask me to say some Muslims but you don't ask others to say some when they talk about Brexit voters , Tories , Yanks but I'm expected to do so because the other day you claimed it would make me better than them ??? 2 ... Brian most wrongs done by Muslims can be traced back to their religion ... Terrorism , FGM , homophobia , hatred of Jews and so on and so on ... Just because you can't accept that doesn't mean I'm wrong 1 You're right, we are, so I'm going to "do an Antony", by way of explanation, :-) and ask you where I claimed it would make you "better than them" if you were more selective - because I don't think I actually said anything of the sort. So, where is it? But, beside that, what's your objection to being better than them? Do you want to be merely the same as "them", or worse? :-D 2 You over simplify. If I say you indiscriminately criticise "Muslims", I mean no more than that, as I think you well understand. So responding to the suggestion that you clarify what and who it is that you are, actually, criticising, by alleging that means I can't accept that Islam has some very strange and unacceptable teachings is indeed going in circles by - avoiding the point I made. You give the impression of being unable to see that there is something between total rejection, and complete acceptance. My point, as you must by now know, is that while some of Islam's teachings are totally unacceptable within any civilised society, not all its teachings are, just as the behaviour of some Muslims is totally unacceptable within a western democracy, but not all Muslims behave in that way. I am all too aware that we have a problem with elements among Muslim immigrants. That is self-evident. My contention is that implying we therefore have a problem with all Muslim immigrants gets us precisely nowhere, and doing so is futile and unhelpful. Seeking to defend that kind of indiscriminate demonising of Islam and its followers by reasoning that because some followers of the Koran are murderers and rapists, it follows that all its followers are a threat to our society, is little, if any, different to the demonising of the Jews to which you so strongly object. Surely you can see that? Sauce, goose, and gander? 2 ... Page 2 3 ... Brian read into my posts what you like as is your right ... I've never said all Muslims are rapists or all Muslims are murderers just as I've never said some are ... For me to take your criticism of me seriously because I don't say some when talking all things Muslim then surely you will have to make an issue of others posts when they fail to say some or all when they mention certain things , fairs fair after all and once you start doing that I might then consider altering my choice of words ... I am glad that you believe we have an issue with Islam here though and in reality it's not just a UK Islamic problem either its the whole world over and a growing one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted April 3, 2018 Share Posted April 3, 2018 Bulletguy - 2018-04-02 5:47 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-02 3:01 PM So DUM DUM why does this so called poll not appear on the Yougov website seeing as they've supposedly carried it out? ;-) .......... Just askin Yet again? *-) ........ Pelmethead........are you seriously so thick or simply being disingenuous or purposely obtuse? I'll make it simple for you but have no pretty pictures to help you. 1) The poll was conducted by YouGov in 2017.......it states that if you look at the chart. I suspect anyone with reasonable IT skill's could knock up the same graphic's as Yougov........Which is why I keep asking why the poll doesn't appear in the Yougov archive? ;-) ......... It's looking to me like a "fake Yougov poll" :D .......... So stop huffing & puffing and find the poll on the Yougov website, then I might believe you >:-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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