Guest pelmetman Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-02-04 1:12 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 12:33 PM.............................. Whether i understand it or not is quite irrelevant to people dying. You have already said ,above,you don't know why. Its well published ( perhaps you've missed it) that diet and immune system are directly linked. Its well published ( ditto) that deaths are linked to overpowering if the immune system. Its well published( ") that looking after your immune system aids fighting covid. If you choose not to believe it...i care not a jot. Just blame Boris , it's very convenient. Make of this what you will, as the numbers (from WHO) are inevitably somewhat out of date (3 Feb 2021), but China has recorded 4,820 deaths attributable to Covid (rate per 100,000 0.35), while the UK has recorded 108,225 (rate per 100,000 162.77). The Chinese figures are probably open to dispute, but even so. . There's no probably about it *-) ........... It remains to be seen whether the WHO will get to........OR tell the truth about their paymasters involvement in starting the virus and China's real death rates :-| ......... I'm not holding my breath ;-) ............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-02-04 1:53 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 1:43 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-04 8:30 AM Bulletguy - 2021-02-03 8:10 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-03 7:50 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-03 7:40 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-03 7:20 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-03 7:09 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-03 6:49 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-03 6:42 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-02-03 6:19 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-03 3:33 PM malc d - 2021-02-03 3:23 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-03 3:06 PM Did those civilians die OF Bombing or WITH Bombing? :-| .................. They died as a result of bombing. I'm surprised you have to ask. :-| Best have a word with Bullet then ;-) ......... As he seems to think everyone who died "with" COVID died "of" COVID rather than Cancer, Dementia etc etc :-| ......... I'll be surprised if that FACT stops LOSERS blaming Boris *-) .......... If someone can't get hospital treatment when they need it because so many beds etc are taken by people suffering from Covid, and as a result they die, what is the actual cause of their death? If someone who has multiple health problems and is admitted to hospital diagnosed with Covid and they die, what is the actual cause of their death. They weren't in hospital before they got Covid, were they? So their other problems didn't hospitalise them, did they? Likely actual cause of death? This is pointless hair splitting because you can't face up to the fact that that Johnson, through his denials, dithering, and reluctance to act when he could have done, has contributed to the number of dead being so high. No-one has claimed he is responsible for all the deaths, jut that he is for a large proportion of them. What is your problem with that self-evident truth? Do you feel he needs your personal shield to protect him? It's like a mother duck trying to protect some wayward duckling! Well said Brian and typically he's avoided answering the questions you raised in the second paragraph. Giggle :D ......... I see the squad are out in force tonight (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... Still no condemnation of their EU chums incompetence.....Who are having to go begging to Russia and China to sort out their vaccine fiasco >:-) ......... Unable to address Brians valid points and reasons you typically resort to deflection and posting a childish comment. As for your Russia comment it just shows how thick you are as Astra Zeneca have been working with Russian scientists since last year with a view to combining the two vaccines. You'd know about this if you pulled your head out of far right hate websites and manic obsession with bashing the EU and began educating yourself with informative reports. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55273907 Why are you deflecting.... I'm not the one deflecting........YOU are, and have been ever since I posted the number of Covid deaths in UK compared to civilian losses in ww2. You've gone on to deflect and rant about EMA, Starmer, Russia......in fact anything to deflect away from your love flames horrendous handling of the pandemic. I think you have a full size image of Boris in your bedroom don't you where you prostrate yourself before him every evening chanting 'Brexit means Brexit'? That reminds me ;-) ........ Did those civilians die "with" Bombing or "of" Bombing? :-| ............ You've already had that explained to you and you lost so are just making yourself look even more stupid now......though that comes naturally for you. And when am I going to get an answer to my question I asked you two days ago in this thread; https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/General-Chat/Chatterbox/How-NASTY-can-EU-be-/56980/181/#M680535 There are two answer choices. Either yes you will go or no you won't, so which is it? So how many of the 107,000 who died with COVID........died of COVID? ;-) ........ It seems to me you dont know, just like the doctors who signed the death certificate obviously dont know :-| ......... Or else the certificate would say "Died of COVID19" .......... I told you yesterday you've already had this explained to you by more than one fm and you're indulging the most pathetic idiotic pedantry i've seen on a forum. It's also pretty sick the depths to which you will sink in your desperation to downplay such a serious matter to try point scoring. You should be utterly ashamed of yourself but you have no moral compass at all. You need to keep up....it was 112,660 at 4pm yesterday and will be more by the end of today. Tell me what the highlighted words state above each figure on this government link https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/deaths By ignoring the question I put to you three days ago it's confirmed what I knew about you all along. Worra Pratt *-) .......... Yes you are though I never expected less from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 2:03 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-04 1:53 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 1:43 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-04 8:30 AM Bulletguy - 2021-02-03 8:10 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-03 7:50 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-03 7:40 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-03 7:20 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-03 7:09 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-03 6:49 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-03 6:42 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-02-03 6:19 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-03 3:33 PM malc d - 2021-02-03 3:23 PM pelmetman - 2021-02-03 3:06 PM Did those civilians die OF Bombing or WITH Bombing? :-| .................. They died as a result of bombing. I'm surprised you have to ask. :-| Best have a word with Bullet then ;-) ......... As he seems to think everyone who died "with" COVID died "of" COVID rather than Cancer, Dementia etc etc :-| ......... I'll be surprised if that FACT stops LOSERS blaming Boris *-) .......... If someone can't get hospital treatment when they need it because so many beds etc are taken by people suffering from Covid, and as a result they die, what is the actual cause of their death? If someone who has multiple health problems and is admitted to hospital diagnosed with Covid and they die, what is the actual cause of their death. They weren't in hospital before they got Covid, were they? So their other problems didn't hospitalise them, did they? Likely actual cause of death? This is pointless hair splitting because you can't face up to the fact that that Johnson, through his denials, dithering, and reluctance to act when he could have done, has contributed to the number of dead being so high. No-one has claimed he is responsible for all the deaths, jut that he is for a large proportion of them. What is your problem with that self-evident truth? Do you feel he needs your personal shield to protect him? It's like a mother duck trying to protect some wayward duckling! Well said Brian and typically he's avoided answering the questions you raised in the second paragraph. Giggle :D ......... I see the squad are out in force tonight (lol) (lol) (lol) ......... Still no condemnation of their EU chums incompetence.....Who are having to go begging to Russia and China to sort out their vaccine fiasco >:-) ......... Unable to address Brians valid points and reasons you typically resort to deflection and posting a childish comment. As for your Russia comment it just shows how thick you are as Astra Zeneca have been working with Russian scientists since last year with a view to combining the two vaccines. You'd know about this if you pulled your head out of far right hate websites and manic obsession with bashing the EU and began educating yourself with informative reports. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55273907 Why are you deflecting.... I'm not the one deflecting........YOU are, and have been ever since I posted the number of Covid deaths in UK compared to civilian losses in ww2. You've gone on to deflect and rant about EMA, Starmer, Russia......in fact anything to deflect away from your love flames horrendous handling of the pandemic. I think you have a full size image of Boris in your bedroom don't you where you prostrate yourself before him every evening chanting 'Brexit means Brexit'? That reminds me ;-) ........ Did those civilians die "with" Bombing or "of" Bombing? :-| ............ You've already had that explained to you and you lost so are just making yourself look even more stupid now......though that comes naturally for you. And when am I going to get an answer to my question I asked you two days ago in this thread; https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/General-Chat/Chatterbox/How-NASTY-can-EU-be-/56980/181/#M680535 There are two answer choices. Either yes you will go or no you won't, so which is it? So how many of the 107,000 who died with COVID........died of COVID? ;-) ........ It seems to me you dont know, just like the doctors who signed the death certificate obviously dont know :-| ......... Or else the certificate would say "Died of COVID19" .......... I told you yesterday you've already had this explained to you by more than one fm and you're indulging the most pathetic idiotic pedantry i've seen on a forum. It's also pretty sick the depths to which you will sink in your desperation to downplay such a serious matter to try point scoring. You should be utterly ashamed of yourself but you have no moral compass at all. You need to keep up....it was 112,660 at 4pm yesterday and will be more by the end of today. Tell me what the highlighted words state above each figure on this government link https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/deaths By ignoring the question I put to you three days ago it's confirmed what I knew about you all along. Worra Pratt *-) .......... Yes you are though I never expected less from you. Coming from you ;-) .......... I'll take that as a compliment B-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurtainRaiser Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 "Dear Baroness Dildo Harding, head of the National Institute for Health Protection. Regarding your statement that "None of us were able to predict coronavirus would mutate or variants would emerge". Was the £20,000,000,000 you were given not enough to buy the Ladybird Book of Viruses and Germs?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 2:01 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 12:33 PM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 12:05 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:57 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:50 AM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:40 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:26 AM pelmetman - 2021-02-04 9:06 AM Unlike you LOSERS I know who to blame for those deaths........CHINA >:-( ........ Well I know a lot of countries are blaming China. But I still cannot see, when if you put the UK death rate up on a world table it ranks at or near the top, even if you just include all the countries that also blame China, why are we so good at killing our people by comparison? Diet. You honestly think that all those countries with a low death rate have significantly different diets to the UK? My wife is Danish her family eat the same stuff we do and probably drink more alcohol, here we have 1,632 deaths per million, in Denmark 372 per million. Has her family died? Yes her mother has. So we already know that you don't understand the immune system and now you want to show that you don't understand statistics either. I have tried to steer you towards the light but you insist on headbutting the steering wheel. Whether i understand it or not is quite irrelevant to people dying. You have already said ,above,you don't know why. Its well published ( perhaps you've missed it) that diet and immune system are directly linked. Its well published ( ditto) that deaths are linked to overpowering if the immune system. Its well published( ") that looking after your immune system aids fighting covid. If you choose not to believe it...i care not a jot. Just blame Boris , it's very convenient. Jumpy mate you need to drop the pontificating about diet, immune system, gutbio and whatever else. My brother-in-law lost his younger brother to Covid on Monday. He was in hospital less than one week and had no underlying health conditions. I think it was Brian who made a valid point yesterday by stating even those with health problems had not gone into hospital because of their condition....they'd been admitted as patients suffering with Covid. I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. People die from covid for a reason,its not random. This is from part of an analysis of patients who died from covid........ In terms of other potentially relevant information, the research team found that 81.2% of the study individuals “had very low eosinophil [a type of white blood cells, which are specialized immune cells that help fight infection] counts on admission [to the hospital].” Among the complications that the patients experienced while hospitalized with COVID-19, some of the most common were respiratory failure, shock, acute respiratory distress syndrome, and cardiac arrhythmia, or irregular heartbeat. As part of their treatment, the majority received antibiotics, antivirals, and glucocorticoids, and some received intravenous immunoglobulins (also known as antibodies), or interferon alpha-2b, which is also a stimulant for the immune response. It was also found that over 60% had underlying heart conditions. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurtainRaiser Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. People die from covid for a reason,its not random. This is from part of an analysis of patients who died from covid........ In terms of other potentially relevant information, the research team found that 81.2% of the study individuals “had very low eosinophil [a type of white blood cells, which are specialized immune cells that help fight infection] counts on admission [to the hospital].” Among the complications that the patients experienced while hospitalized with COVID-19, some of the most common were respiratory failure, shock, acute respiratory distress syndrome, and cardiac arrhythmia, or irregular heartbeat. As part of their treatment, the majority received antibiotics, antivirals, and glucocorticoids, and some received intravenous immunoglobulins (also known as antibodies), or interferon alpha-2b, which is also a stimulant for the immune response. It was also found that over 60% had underlying heart conditions. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. So where is your source for these statements? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 pelmetman - 2021-02-03 7:03 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-02-03 6:55 PM Why would I waste my time "slagging off" the EU? Their collective poor performance is obvious and is a tragedy for the member states, thousands of whose population are dying as a consequence. Why on earth do you think they panicked? They've blobbed. Why not? ;-) .........If you weren't biased you would >:-) ........ Come on Dave, clean the zealot grime from the lenses! :-D What does my post you quoted above say? That they have done better than everyone else, or otherwise? You're playing Jemima again! :-D Quackety, quackety quack, quack, QUACK! :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 2:01 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 12:33 PM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 12:05 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:57 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:50 AM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:40 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:26 AM pelmetman - 2021-02-04 9:06 AM Unlike you LOSERS I know who to blame for those deaths........CHINA >:-( ........ Well I know a lot of countries are blaming China. But I still cannot see, when if you put the UK death rate up on a world table it ranks at or near the top, even if you just include all the countries that also blame China, why are we so good at killing our people by comparison? Diet. You honestly think that all those countries with a low death rate have significantly different diets to the UK? My wife is Danish her family eat the same stuff we do and probably drink more alcohol, here we have 1,632 deaths per million, in Denmark 372 per million. Has her family died? Yes her mother has. So we already know that you don't understand the immune system and now you want to show that you don't understand statistics either. I have tried to steer you towards the light but you insist on headbutting the steering wheel. Whether i understand it or not is quite irrelevant to people dying. You have already said ,above,you don't know why. Its well published ( perhaps you've missed it) that diet and immune system are directly linked. Its well published ( ditto) that deaths are linked to overpowering if the immune system. Its well published( ") that looking after your immune system aids fighting covid. If you choose not to believe it...i care not a jot. Just blame Boris , it's very convenient. Jumpy mate you need to drop the pontificating about diet, immune system, gutbio and whatever else. My brother-in-law lost his younger brother to Covid on Monday. He was in hospital less than one week and had no underlying health conditions. I think it was Brian who made a valid point yesterday by stating even those with health problems had not gone into hospital because of their condition....they'd been admitted as patients suffering with Covid. I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. As I said he had none and stating it certainly isn't premature. He's dead. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. An underlying health condition isn't what put them in hospital, Covid did and thats the killer, not the underlying health problem. It may not help, but it most certainly is not what put them on a ventilator. Seriously mate some of your views are coming on a bit strong and before long you'll be excusing Covid deaths due to age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 4:48 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 2:01 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 12:33 PM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 12:05 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:57 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:50 AM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:40 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:26 AM pelmetman - 2021-02-04 9:06 AM Unlike you LOSERS I know who to blame for those deaths........CHINA >:-( ........ Well I know a lot of countries are blaming China. But I still cannot see, when if you put the UK death rate up on a world table it ranks at or near the top, even if you just include all the countries that also blame China, why are we so good at killing our people by comparison? Diet. You honestly think that all those countries with a low death rate have significantly different diets to the UK? My wife is Danish her family eat the same stuff we do and probably drink more alcohol, here we have 1,632 deaths per million, in Denmark 372 per million. Has her family died? Yes her mother has. So we already know that you don't understand the immune system and now you want to show that you don't understand statistics either. I have tried to steer you towards the light but you insist on headbutting the steering wheel. Whether i understand it or not is quite irrelevant to people dying. You have already said ,above,you don't know why. Its well published ( perhaps you've missed it) that diet and immune system are directly linked. Its well published ( ditto) that deaths are linked to overpowering if the immune system. Its well published( ") that looking after your immune system aids fighting covid. If you choose not to believe it...i care not a jot. Just blame Boris , it's very convenient. Jumpy mate you need to drop the pontificating about diet, immune system, gutbio and whatever else. My brother-in-law lost his younger brother to Covid on Monday. He was in hospital less than one week and had no underlying health conditions. I think it was Brian who made a valid point yesterday by stating even those with health problems had not gone into hospital because of their condition....they'd been admitted as patients suffering with Covid. I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. As I said he had none and stating it certainly isn't premature. He's dead. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. An underlying health condition isn't what put them in hospital, Covid did and thats the killer, not the underlying health problem. It may not help, but it most certainly is not what put them on a ventilator. Seriously mate some of your views are coming on a bit strong and before long you'll be excusing Covid deaths due to age. Quite wrong, covid may be what killed them ,due to it overwhelming their immune system,did you not read what i posted above? Very few people who get covid actually die. If these views are a bit strong for you i suggest you sit down and take a few deep breaths. Age very much is a factor as the older you get the more things affect your immune system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-02-04 1:12 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 12:33 PM.............................. Whether i understand it or not is quite irrelevant to people dying. You have already said ,above,you don't know why. Its well published ( perhaps you've missed it) that diet and immune system are directly linked. Its well published ( ditto) that deaths are linked to overpowering if the immune system. Its well published( ") that looking after your immune system aids fighting covid. If you choose not to believe it...i care not a jot. Just blame Boris , it's very convenient. Make of this what you will, as the numbers (from WHO) are inevitably somewhat out of date (3 Feb 2021), but China has recorded 4,820 deaths attributable to Covid (rate per 100,000 0.35), while the UK has recorded 108,225 (rate per 100,000 162.77). The Chinese figures are probably open to dispute, but even so. China was the first country in the world to be affected, so they had no advance warning of what was coming. The UK had several weeks of advance notice within which to begin preparation. I have to say that trying to explain that that huge difference in spread and lethality of the virus on the strength of the stronger immune systems of the Chinese - where smoking (at least among the males) is endemic - seems, literally, incredible, and liable to be dangerously misleading. A healthy immune system will undoubtedly help, but not by that much. Don't put too much faith in it John - the other measures are even more important to survival and avoidance. China seemed to contain it quite well though it was probably already too late to prevent other countries getting it. I have no idea what the immune system of chinese is like but it was from their own analysis i posted above that showed over 60% underlying undisclosed heart problems on covid death patients. A healthy immune system is all that keeps you from dying from just mild common viruses. This is why the drugs you are given is to stimulate your immune system when in hospital. Most recover ,some dont. Avoidance is obviously the number one thing to do. By the way it was announced today that daily dose of vitieman D cuts the likelyhood of catching covid when exposed to it by 30%. Something to do with immune system and all that...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:57 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 4:48 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 2:01 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 12:33 PM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 12:05 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:57 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:50 AM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:40 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:26 AM pelmetman - 2021-02-04 9:06 AM Unlike you LOSERS I know who to blame for those deaths........CHINA >:-( ........ Well I know a lot of countries are blaming China. But I still cannot see, when if you put the UK death rate up on a world table it ranks at or near the top, even if you just include all the countries that also blame China, why are we so good at killing our people by comparison? Diet. You honestly think that all those countries with a low death rate have significantly different diets to the UK? My wife is Danish her family eat the same stuff we do and probably drink more alcohol, here we have 1,632 deaths per million, in Denmark 372 per million. Has her family died? Yes her mother has. So we already know that you don't understand the immune system and now you want to show that you don't understand statistics either. I have tried to steer you towards the light but you insist on headbutting the steering wheel. Whether i understand it or not is quite irrelevant to people dying. You have already said ,above,you don't know why. Its well published ( perhaps you've missed it) that diet and immune system are directly linked. Its well published ( ditto) that deaths are linked to overpowering if the immune system. Its well published( ") that looking after your immune system aids fighting covid. If you choose not to believe it...i care not a jot. Just blame Boris , it's very convenient. Jumpy mate you need to drop the pontificating about diet, immune system, gutbio and whatever else. My brother-in-law lost his younger brother to Covid on Monday. He was in hospital less than one week and had no underlying health conditions. I think it was Brian who made a valid point yesterday by stating even those with health problems had not gone into hospital because of their condition....they'd been admitted as patients suffering with Covid. I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. As I said he had none and stating it certainly isn't premature. He's dead. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. An underlying health condition isn't what put them in hospital, Covid did and thats the killer, not the underlying health problem. It may not help, but it most certainly is not what put them on a ventilator. Seriously mate some of your views are coming on a bit strong and before long you'll be excusing Covid deaths due to age. Quite wrong, covid may be what killed them ,due to it overwhelming their immune system,did you not read what i posted above? Very few people who get covid actually die. If these views are a bit strong for you i suggest you sit down and take a few deep breaths. Age very much is a factor as the older you get the more things affect your immune system. Yeah I read what you wrote and disagree with your views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 5:18 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:57 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 4:48 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 2:01 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 12:33 PM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 12:05 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:57 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:50 AM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:40 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:26 AM pelmetman - 2021-02-04 9:06 AM Unlike you LOSERS I know who to blame for those deaths........CHINA >:-( ........ Well I know a lot of countries are blaming China. But I still cannot see, when if you put the UK death rate up on a world table it ranks at or near the top, even if you just include all the countries that also blame China, why are we so good at killing our people by comparison? Diet. You honestly think that all those countries with a low death rate have significantly different diets to the UK? My wife is Danish her family eat the same stuff we do and probably drink more alcohol, here we have 1,632 deaths per million, in Denmark 372 per million. Has her family died? Yes her mother has. So we already know that you don't understand the immune system and now you want to show that you don't understand statistics either. I have tried to steer you towards the light but you insist on headbutting the steering wheel. Whether i understand it or not is quite irrelevant to people dying. You have already said ,above,you don't know why. Its well published ( perhaps you've missed it) that diet and immune system are directly linked. Its well published ( ditto) that deaths are linked to overpowering if the immune system. Its well published( ") that looking after your immune system aids fighting covid. If you choose not to believe it...i care not a jot. Just blame Boris , it's very convenient. Jumpy mate you need to drop the pontificating about diet, immune system, gutbio and whatever else. My brother-in-law lost his younger brother to Covid on Monday. He was in hospital less than one week and had no underlying health conditions. I think it was Brian who made a valid point yesterday by stating even those with health problems had not gone into hospital because of their condition....they'd been admitted as patients suffering with Covid. I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. As I said he had none and stating it certainly isn't premature. He's dead. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. An underlying health condition isn't what put them in hospital, Covid did and thats the killer, not the underlying health problem. It may not help, but it most certainly is not what put them on a ventilator. Seriously mate some of your views are coming on a bit strong and before long you'll be excusing Covid deaths due to age. Quite wrong, covid may be what killed them ,due to it overwhelming their immune system,did you not read what i posted above? Very few people who get covid actually die. If these views are a bit strong for you i suggest you sit down and take a few deep breaths. Age very much is a factor as the older you get the more things affect your immune system. Yeah I read what you wrote and disagree with your views. They were’nt my views it was a report on the analysis of patients who died from covid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM...............................Brians point is inaccurate because lots of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem........................ What I actually said was "If someone who has multiple health problems and is admitted to hospital diagnosed with Covid and they die, what is the actual cause of their death? They weren't in hospital before they got Covid, were they? So their other problems didn't hospitalise them, did they? Likely actual cause of death?" It wasn't quite the same point (though I'll admit it could have been better phrased! :-)). The point I was wanting to make was that if someone with multiple health problems is diagnosed with Covid, is admitted to hospital, and subsequently dies, and was not admitted because of the other health problems, Covid would be the most likely cause of their death. For their other problems to be so mild that they had remained unaware of them, it seems they must have been very mild indeed. So far as I am aware, although the other problems may have contributed to their eventual death, the main reason they died will surely nave been Covid? For instance, an undiagnosed kidney infection might well be exacerbated by Covid, but could readily have been treated in the absence of Covid. It would seem illogical to then attribute death to the kidney infection, and not to Covid. Is that unfair? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 jumpstart - 2021-02-04 5:25 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 5:18 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:57 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 4:48 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM Bulletguy - 2021-02-04 2:01 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 12:33 PM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 12:05 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:57 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:50 AM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 11:40 AM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 11:26 AM pelmetman - 2021-02-04 9:06 AM Unlike you LOSERS I know who to blame for those deaths........CHINA >:-( ........ Well I know a lot of countries are blaming China. But I still cannot see, when if you put the UK death rate up on a world table it ranks at or near the top, even if you just include all the countries that also blame China, why are we so good at killing our people by comparison? Diet. You honestly think that all those countries with a low death rate have significantly different diets to the UK? My wife is Danish her family eat the same stuff we do and probably drink more alcohol, here we have 1,632 deaths per million, in Denmark 372 per million. Has her family died? Yes her mother has. So we already know that you don't understand the immune system and now you want to show that you don't understand statistics either. I have tried to steer you towards the light but you insist on headbutting the steering wheel. Whether i understand it or not is quite irrelevant to people dying. You have already said ,above,you don't know why. Its well published ( perhaps you've missed it) that diet and immune system are directly linked. Its well published ( ditto) that deaths are linked to overpowering if the immune system. Its well published( ") that looking after your immune system aids fighting covid. If you choose not to believe it...i care not a jot. Just blame Boris , it's very convenient. Jumpy mate you need to drop the pontificating about diet, immune system, gutbio and whatever else. My brother-in-law lost his younger brother to Covid on Monday. He was in hospital less than one week and had no underlying health conditions. I think it was Brian who made a valid point yesterday by stating even those with health problems had not gone into hospital because of their condition....they'd been admitted as patients suffering with Covid. I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. As I said he had none and stating it certainly isn't premature. He's dead. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. An underlying health condition isn't what put them in hospital, Covid did and thats the killer, not the underlying health problem. It may not help, but it most certainly is not what put them on a ventilator. Seriously mate some of your views are coming on a bit strong and before long you'll be excusing Covid deaths due to age. Quite wrong, covid may be what killed them ,due to it overwhelming their immune system,did you not read what i posted above? Very few people who get covid actually die. If these views are a bit strong for you i suggest you sit down and take a few deep breaths. Age very much is a factor as the older you get the more things affect your immune system. Yeah I read what you wrote and disagree with your views. They were’nt my views it was a report on the analysis of patients who died from covid. Then why not post it up so we can all read it? :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurtainRaiser Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 jumpstart - 2021-02-04 5:11 PM China seemed to contain it quite well though it was probably already too late to prevent other countries getting it. I have no idea what the immune system of chinese is like but it was from their own analysis i posted above that showed over 60% underlying undisclosed heart problems on covid death patients. A healthy immune system is all that keeps you from dying from just mild common viruses. This is why the drugs you are given is to stimulate your immune system when in hospital. Most recover ,some dont. Avoidance is obviously the number one thing to do. By the way it was announced today that daily dose of vitieman D cuts the likelyhood of catching covid when exposed to it by 30%. Something to do with immune system and all that...... But what your statements about the impact of a "good" immune system on deaths doesn't explain is why countries with similar diets, smoking statistics, alcoholic consumption etc have such massive differences in the number of deaths. What is behind that difference? Might it just be that a higher number are getting infected and consequently a high proportion of deaths because of mismanagement allowing the various to spread? Or are you suggesting that the UK is full of people with "poor" immune systems compared to other countries - are we the sick man of the world? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 4:12 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. People die from covid for a reason,its not random. This is from part of an analysis of patients who died from covid........ In terms of other potentially relevant information, the research team found that 81.2% of the study individuals “had very low eosinophil [a type of white blood cells, which are specialized immune cells that help fight infection] counts on admission [to the hospital].” Among the complications that the patients experienced while hospitalized with COVID-19, some of the most common were respiratory failure, shock, acute respiratory distress syndrome, and cardiac arrhythmia, or irregular heartbeat. As part of their treatment, the majority received antibiotics, antivirals, and glucocorticoids, and some received intravenous immunoglobulins (also known as antibodies), or interferon alpha-2b, which is also a stimulant for the immune response. It was also found that over 60% had underlying heart conditions. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. So where is your source for these statements? https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/what-factors-did-people-who-died-with-covid-19-have-in-common Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 5:37 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 5:11 PM China seemed to contain it quite well though it was probably already too late to prevent other countries getting it. I have no idea what the immune system of chinese is like but it was from their own analysis i posted above that showed over 60% underlying undisclosed heart problems on covid death patients. A healthy immune system is all that keeps you from dying from just mild common viruses. This is why the drugs you are given is to stimulate your immune system when in hospital. Most recover ,some dont. Avoidance is obviously the number one thing to do. By the way it was announced today that daily dose of vitieman D cuts the likelyhood of catching covid when exposed to it by 30%. Something to do with immune system and all that...... But what your statements about the impact of a "good" immune system on deaths doesn't explain is why countries with similar diets, smoking statistics, alcoholic consumption etc have such massive differences in the number of deaths. What is behind that difference? Might it just be that a higher number are getting infected and consequently a high proportion of deaths because of mismanagement allowing the various to spread? Or are you suggesting that the UK is full of people with "poor" immune systems compared to other countries - are we the sick man of the world? The quick answer is ..i dont know. Research is on going and complex. Im only giving alternatives to " its all Boris". Why people who catch covid but are not hospitalised ...needs resurching. It definitely IS to do with your immune system and everything that enhances it. My father in law is 93 He has been in hospital several times last year including two major operations . He's a diabetic, he's on a out 20 pills a day, but he hasn't caught covid. His immune system is shot but he's still isolating at home. He's had his first jab. He certainly wouldn't survive getting covid,but shows if you dont get it you can survive. And yes generally this country has a very poor diet,but then 98% are surviving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurtainRaiser Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 jumpstart - 2021-02-04 5:57 PM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 4:12 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. People die from covid for a reason,its not random. This is from part of an analysis of patients who died from covid........ In terms of other potentially relevant information, the research team found that 81.2% of the study individuals “had very low eosinophil [a type of white blood cells, which are specialized immune cells that help fight infection] counts on admission [to the hospital].” Among the complications that the patients experienced while hospitalized with COVID-19, some of the most common were respiratory failure, shock, acute respiratory distress syndrome, and cardiac arrhythmia, or irregular heartbeat. As part of their treatment, the majority received antibiotics, antivirals, and glucocorticoids, and some received intravenous immunoglobulins (also known as antibodies), or interferon alpha-2b, which is also a stimulant for the immune response. It was also found that over 60% had underlying heart conditions. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. So where is your source for these statements? https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/what-factors-did-people-who-died-with-covid-19-have-in-common Its more than a year old and even the statistics on the demographic of those affected have been overtaken by events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 6:10 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 5:57 PM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 4:12 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. People die from covid for a reason,its not random. This is from part of an analysis of patients who died from covid........ In terms of other potentially relevant information, the research team found that 81.2% of the study individuals “had very low eosinophil [a type of white blood cells, which are specialized immune cells that help fight infection] counts on admission [to the hospital].” Among the complications that the patients experienced while hospitalized with COVID-19, some of the most common were respiratory failure, shock, acute respiratory distress syndrome, and cardiac arrhythmia, or irregular heartbeat. As part of their treatment, the majority received antibiotics, antivirals, and glucocorticoids, and some received intravenous immunoglobulins (also known as antibodies), or interferon alpha-2b, which is also a stimulant for the immune response. It was also found that over 60% had underlying heart conditions. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. So where is your source for these statements? https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/what-factors-did-people-who-died-with-covid-19-have-in-common Its more than a year old and even the statistics on the demographic of those affected have been overtaken by events. So prove it all wrong then.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 Warning- This contains information on immune system. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1876034120305670 This adequately shows why your immune system is so important. Note at the end it gives information on how important diet and hydration is to you. Boris isn't mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 6:10 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 5:57 PM CurtainRaiser - 2021-02-04 4:12 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM I assume you are not actually serious in asking me to drop the subject. Its a shame obviously when people die from covid but for you to say there was no underlying conditions is premature. People die from covid for a reason,its not random. This is from part of an analysis of patients who died from covid........ In terms of other potentially relevant information, the research team found that 81.2% of the study individuals “had very low eosinophil [a type of white blood cells, which are specialized immune cells that help fight infection] counts on admission [to the hospital].” Among the complications that the patients experienced while hospitalized with COVID-19, some of the most common were respiratory failure, shock, acute respiratory distress syndrome, and cardiac arrhythmia, or irregular heartbeat. As part of their treatment, the majority received antibiotics, antivirals, and glucocorticoids, and some received intravenous immunoglobulins (also known as antibodies), or interferon alpha-2b, which is also a stimulant for the immune response. It was also found that over 60% had underlying heart conditions. Brians point is inaccurate because lits of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem. If you feel happier blaming Boris go right ahead and i will mention other things to take into account like diet and immune system. So where is your source for these statements? https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/what-factors-did-people-who-died-with-covid-19-have-in-common Its more than a year old and even the statistics on the demographic of those affected have been overtaken by events. You got further than I did with it then. It 'detects' me as being in the EU/EEA and subject to the General Data Protection Regulation. Probably a good thing as possibly US origin and full of CT stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teflon2 Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-02-04 5:34 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM...............................Brians point is inaccurate because lots of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem........................ What I actually said was "If someone who has multiple health problems and is admitted to hospital diagnosed with Covid and they die, what is the actual cause of their death? They weren't in hospital before they got Covid, were they? So their other problems didn't hospitalise them, did they? Likely actual cause of death?" It wasn't quite the same point (though I'll admit it could have been better phrased! :-)). The point I was wanting to make was that if someone with multiple health problems is diagnosed with Covid, is admitted to hospital, and subsequently dies, and was not admitted because of the other health problems, Covid would be the most likely cause of their death. For their other problems to be so mild that they had remained unaware of them, it seems they must have been very mild indeed. So far as I am aware, although the other problems may have contributed to their eventual death, the main reason they died will surely nave been Covid? For instance, an undiagnosed kidney infection might well be exacerbated by Covid, but could readily have been treated in the absence of Covid. It would seem illogical to then attribute death to the kidney infection, and not to Covid. Is that unfair? Just a point , the nurse that gave me my anti pneumonia injection said that while it would not help with covid19 it would prevent me having to be hospitalised as I would only develop minor or no pneumonia symptoms and pneumonia is what most covid patients die of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 teflon2 - 2021-02-04 7:36 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-02-04 5:34 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM...............................Brians point is inaccurate because lots of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem........................ What I actually said was "If someone who has multiple health problems and is admitted to hospital diagnosed with Covid and they die, what is the actual cause of their death? They weren't in hospital before they got Covid, were they? So their other problems didn't hospitalise them, did they? Likely actual cause of death?" It wasn't quite the same point (though I'll admit it could have been better phrased! :-)). The point I was wanting to make was that if someone with multiple health problems is diagnosed with Covid, is admitted to hospital, and subsequently dies, and was not admitted because of the other health problems, Covid would be the most likely cause of their death. For their other problems to be so mild that they had remained unaware of them, it seems they must have been very mild indeed. So far as I am aware, although the other problems may have contributed to their eventual death, the main reason they died will surely nave been Covid? For instance, an undiagnosed kidney infection might well be exacerbated by Covid, but could readily have been treated in the absence of Covid. It would seem illogical to then attribute death to the kidney infection, and not to Covid. Is that unfair? Just a point , the nurse that gave me my anti pneumonia injection said that while it would not help with covid19 it would prevent me having to be hospitalised as I would only develop minor or no pneumonia symptoms and pneumonia is what most covid patients die of. There is viral pneumonia and bacterial pneumonia and many different sorts of both. The jab you had would’nt necessarily protect against a pneumonia when your immune system or other organs are damaged and collapse. But there again maybe you’ll be lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurtainRaiser Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 teflon2 - 2021-02-04 7:36 PM Brian Kirby - 2021-02-04 5:34 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM...............................Brians point is inaccurate because lots of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem........................ What I actually said was "If someone who has multiple health problems and is admitted to hospital diagnosed with Covid and they die, what is the actual cause of their death? They weren't in hospital before they got Covid, were they? So their other problems didn't hospitalise them, did they? Likely actual cause of death?" It wasn't quite the same point (though I'll admit it could have been better phrased! :-)). The point I was wanting to make was that if someone with multiple health problems is diagnosed with Covid, is admitted to hospital, and subsequently dies, and was not admitted because of the other health problems, Covid would be the most likely cause of their death. For their other problems to be so mild that they had remained unaware of them, it seems they must have been very mild indeed. So far as I am aware, although the other problems may have contributed to their eventual death, the main reason they died will surely nave been Covid? For instance, an undiagnosed kidney infection might well be exacerbated by Covid, but could readily have been treated in the absence of Covid. It would seem illogical to then attribute death to the kidney infection, and not to Covid. Is that unfair? Just a point , the nurse that gave me my anti pneumonia injection said that while it would not help with covid19 it would prevent me having to be hospitalised as I would only develop minor or no pneumonia symptoms and pneumonia is what most covid patients die of. She is giving you a somewhat simplistic explanation, probably to provide you with reassurance, she should have perhaps added the caveat that it' is what most older patients die of. Across the wider population Covid deaths are from a large range of complications not just pneumonia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 Brian Kirby - 2021-02-04 5:34 PM jumpstart - 2021-02-04 4:06 PM...............................Brians point is inaccurate because lots of people have underlying health problems without realising it so haven't been to hospital. When they get covid it then becomes a problem........................ What I actually said was "If someone who has multiple health problems and is admitted to hospital diagnosed with Covid and they die, what is the actual cause of their death? They weren't in hospital before they got Covid, were they? So their other problems didn't hospitalise them, did they? Likely actual cause of death?" It wasn't quite the same point (though I'll admit it could have been better phrased! :-)). The point I was wanting to make was that if someone with multiple health problems is diagnosed with Covid, is admitted to hospital, and subsequently dies, and was not admitted because of the other health problems, Covid would be the most likely cause of their death. For their other problems to be so mild that they had remained unaware of them, it seems they must have been very mild indeed. So far as I am aware, although the other problems may have contributed to their eventual death, the main reason they died will surely nave been Covid? For instance, an undiagnosed kidney infection might well be exacerbated by Covid, but could readily have been treated in the absence of Covid. It would seem illogical to then attribute death to the kidney infection, and not to Covid. Is that unfair? Sorry missed this Brian. I don’t disagree that covid causes death, because it suppresses your unhealthy immune system. There are people with underlying health problems who have survived in hospital. There are people over 100 who have survived. Why do you think that is? Immune system is key. Without it you are probably dead as a duck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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